>>72663
-No, if there is a direct line from the square to your square then the shield will not protect you. Only medic shields block direct diagonals.
-Yes, yes, yes.
-No.
-Yes.
-Yes.

Hrm, couldn't help but wonder if anyone could use an [E] turret, and not necessarily the [E] who placed it...

>>72670
No.

When I (and if I survive to) get one, could I use a promotion improvement to give my [E] structures +1 AR?

[E] force walls cannot be walked through, right?

>>72846
No, but you can give them additional hit points.

>>73155
No, they cannot.

More questions episode 6: the questioning:
- Can I only place a force-wall in the border of a square I am in, or can I do something like placing a force-wall in a square to the left of me facing upwards?
- Turrets provide vision (while force walls of course do not), right?
- Can I use a promotion benefit to increase my 'ammo' of turrets or force-walls I can carry?
- Am I right in thinking that increasing the health is spent per structure rather than for structures in general?

>>73204

-Force walls occupy whole squares.
-Yes.
-Yes.
-Per type of structure, yes.

>>73204
Sorry, misread that first question. You can place a force wall in any adjacent square facing any chosen direction.

[I1] Pvt. Eli Minativik 2013/07/04(Thu)18:56 No. 73213 ID: 561606
File 137298935914.gif - (2.71MB , 320x240 , h46343B91.gif )

>>/quest/521464
We are on our 2nd turn. Squad Alpha charged over open plains into fortified enemy positions. Squad Beta is too far away to engage.

We lost a medic.

It took Squad Beta four attempts to activate a static shield generator.

Except for the sniper, nobody's hitting shit.

I wasn't even sure how to open doors.

Hey, it's BASIC training. Cut us some slack, HQ.

>>73213
It's in the true tradition of Black Company. All's best when all's going wrong.

>>73213
Accurate depiction of my last shot.

>>/quest/521785
Because Sgt. Azure brought it up:

Aimed Shot: Burst Firing:
60% 65,7% Chance to hit at least once
0% 21,6% Chance to hit at least twice
0% 2,7% Chance to hit thrice

Except for using up a lot of ammo, Burst Firing is better than Aimed Shot at hitting once. With the bonus of maybe doing extra damage.

To kill the [I] in the current scenario:
Me using burst fire [8] twice and hitting at least twice each time: 4,6%
Me using Burst Fire [8] and a telekinetic [5] hitting once: 3,92%
Me using Aimed Shot [5] and a telekinetic [5] hitting once: 3,6% -> I went for the worst option

So, Sgt. Azure was right, Burst Fire would have been the better option, since I don't have to conserve ammo at the moment.

On the other hand, the difference in this situation is A) not that big and B) our dice rolls have not been inspiring confidence so far. I made a false estimation of the probability, but I also didn't "feel" I could roll a 8+ today in 3 tries.
If the target isn't killed in this round by a Telekinetic, it would have been likely that the target would have survived for 2 turns with 1-2 HP anyway. And I would be out of 1 magazine.

So what are the rules for shooting past squares with people in them?

>>73257
"You will never shoot an ally with a bullet unless disoriented, but explosives are unpredictable."

Eli the dedicated rules hound

>>/quest/522150
I thought R stands for "rounds". 5/9 rounds loaded and two 9 round magazines.

But I'll keep it in mind.

Also, holy shit natural 10s.

>>73293
Both are valid interpretations, but I'm pretty sure it was 'reloads' in Skirmish Quest.

>>73296
In any way, I don't think it hurts if I keep track the amount of ammunition I have left in my gun every turn.

>>/quest/522325
It's comforting to know nobody is dying during this training, even if we don't get promotions.

But I think it was a good idea to do training. We have a few veterans, but also some new people, myself included. And as we can see, some things which are not clear can seriously hamper us (like how Squad Alpha thought they could use the soft cover when it was only the enemy behind it who benefitted). The fact that we cannot move diagonally through doors (I moved diagonally through a door once, but because I sprinted I had a lot of move and I think the GM simply accommodated accordingly without commenting on it).

But seriously, the false belief of reaching the chest-high cover on the map is the single biggest reason why Squad Alpha is getting pummeled. That, and our rocketeers didn't drink their scope.

Lessons learned so far:
Enemies can pop up behind soft cover.
Let people with a lot of HP open doors, if possible. They can be patched up by medics if needed.

In open fields: Spread out to avoid explosives. Cardinal grid distances being equal to diagonal grid distances means you can still fire on the same target.
In buildings: Stay together. Explosives are almost too dangerous to be used and close proximities mean you can almost always retaliate if your squaddies are downed. We were a bit unlucky in the yellow room, but on the other hand, a Telekinetic is the natural counter to shields. And the shield of the Doc was the "bulk" of that forward element. They took our Doc and our Telekinetic out fair-and-square. It's useless to argue hypotheticals, but if I had opened the door, we would have probably lost only one person and have better chances to retaliate.

Most importantly:
VISION. Scouting is key. I can't emphasis this enough. Get vision wherever possible and make extensive use of the looking-around-corners rule.

Our system tells us to MOVE before we ATTACK.
Our system also means we can only ATTACK a unit AFTER we SPOTTED it.
Our system also means our VISION is updated AFTER we MOVE.

Which means we can walk into a room full of enemy combatants without having any chance to fire back or even knowing they were there.
Those who attack first are most likely to win a firefight due to the turn-based system.

Scouting. Scoutign. Scouting. Since we share our HUD vision, scouting for the team means everybody knows where to shoot and where to seek cover.

Specifically for combat in buildings: Opening a door, moving a step to the side and looking through the doorframe seems to be superior to entering the room after opening the door.

Kinda related to this is the following:
I think everybody is, understandibly, enthusiastic about getting into action. Especially with turn lasting something around a day (which I do not criticise, it is a convinience for the participants) - we have to realise that , moving carefully and even baiting the enemy, retreating and setting up an ambush can mean having to wait 2-3 days until we get to roll some dice; rushing forward, shooting now and asking questions later is much more satisfying as a game experience (I'm not talking about anyone specifically, I'm expressing my own thoughts), but THIS can result in getting your ass kicked.

However, I think we can find a balance between waiting one week for an elaborate ploy to play out and not running into entrenched positions and unscouted rooms. It can be beneficial to stop and wait for your squad to catch up and get into position, or to wait a turn and just position yourself to get optimal vision of things ahead.

Lastly, there seem to be some hard rock-paper-scissor rules to Black Company. Infantrymen are durable, but have mediocre damage. [I] can take out medics and Telekinetics with a single hit - but two [I] firing at each other is a fight of attrition. A telekinetic, however, ignores AR. Snipers can negate shields. Engineers are suited for combat in open fields - they create cover with shield walls and smoke grenades. I think Alpha would have appreciated some smoke screens.

That means there are situations when communicating with your squadmates about the order in which you fire is highly beneficial - having a sniper destroy a shild generator before an infantryman fires at the meat behind, for example. But communications are sometimes obstructed by some of us only being online for a limited time during a day/turn.

Lastly, Samuel, there have been some occasions of people moving to places where they didn't intend to move. Just saying, that can create some confusion at times. ;)

A better idea for door clearing is not to stand right in front of it. You have all the time in the world to get set up. Have someone run by the door and open it before putting some distance between them, and have someone else scope it out from afar or run through to a safer position. You can also use the [E]ngineer's smoke grenade to pass through without harm.

Taking your time to execute coordinated tactics is beneficial to you in nearly every possible way. It may draw out enemies from their fortified positions. It gets you a promotion in fewer missions. It prevents the "sorry but I can't help, I'm too far away" thing. It gives everyone a chance to reload and get into a crouched/prone position. It's sound advice.

>>73319
I am fallible. I set up OPS so that I would be able to process orders with as few mistakes as possible, but I still make them. I try and correct them if I can and usually tip the scales in the favor of the person who got confused at least temporarily.

>>73322
That's absolutely understandable. The thread is not what I'd call "clear".

But then, the heat of battle and all that...

Directly relevant to the situation at hand this time:
Can you close a door, and if you do will the enemies need a turn to spot you again before shooting you?
If medic successfully heals someone above zero, do they get a move that turn?

As you saw when your medic died, your sight persists for an enemy turn, and so does the enemies'.

When you are an [E] or [M] with two actions, is there a way to make them conditional / in two posts, or do they need to be done at the same time? In this case, if my first action in a turn is to attempt to place a turret, do I need to commit to what my second action will be before knowing if the turret will place the first time?

>>73933
Your actions cannot be conditional and must be made in the same post. You must commit to whatever you do without knowing whether or not it will work.

>>73933
By the way, you CAN make an action with the turret you place down in the same turn, you just have to take the chance that it won't be placed and both your actions will go to waste.

>>73947
Yes, though I was not in a mood to trust the dice at the time. However, reading your comment compelled me to run some numbers, and it turns out that with no modifiers Place/Shoot has a better expected damage over that turn and the following turn than Place/Place. (1.02 hits vs .825 hits)

>Today's update
Welp. I am tempted to take it personally that that [I] was nowhere for several turns then shows up at exactly the time to keep me useless.

Do smoke grenades help against telekinetic death? Because smoke grenades are the only remotely useful thing I can do here.

>>73953
If the enemy can't spot for the [T] the [T] can't attack you. The smoke grenades take a turn or so to be effective, though.

Can enemies shoot past you, or can you body-block their attacks?

>>73956
Enemies can shoot past enemies, but not you or your allies, unless you're crouching and your ally is standing, etc.

How does changing moves work? I tried a plan, it didn't work, and then immediately afterwards I remembered that it could not have worked for the entirely different reason that [I]s can use grenades to just ignore my walls in addition to anything else I can do.

>>73985
I think the idea is, when you used the right posting syntax, that you just post new orders, which then override your old ones.

I don't know if that is possible after dice rolling, it would seem kinda exploitable then.

>>73997
I understand the exploitable aspect, but I am under the impression that the optimal posting syntax includes having the dice rolls in the same post as the order.
Does that mean you can only change action if all rolls succeed, or is there some system where you go with the worse of the rolls?

>>73998
From the wiki: "If you are using OPS, then you may change your action at any time by linking to the previous action and posting another action in Optimal Post Syntax."

It says ANY TIME, so I guess forget dice rolls, statistical independence and all that.

>>73998
This isn't meant to be a quip at you, but I really like how you back off, saying "I can't help you Void, you're on your own!" and then he has to watch how you place a forcefield at the entrance between you and him.

You're free to change your orders whenever. If it's obvious you're just doing it because you rolled badly I'll tell you to stop.

>>74005
We can cross our own team's fields, I thought?

>>74007
You can shoot through them, you can't walk through them.

>>74005
He has to watch as I fail pathetically to put up a force-wall across the exit :/

My first plan was to attempt to save him using force-walls and body blocking, but that wouldn't work because the [I] has grenades that ignore force-walls.
With the doorway blocking plan, if I had placed the wall (which I failed to) and Void miraculously survived, it would be fairly simple to pick up the wall next round.

Do unconscious people obstruct structures, and is it possible to drag them?

>>74126
Incapacitated soldiers don't block structures, and I think last time it came up I said you couldn't drag them?

>>/quest/527949
We have enough people incapacitated that we are very close to not having enough damage at our disposal if the enemy just blindly rushes at us. We could not put them down fast enough and would take a few hits each turn, regardless how carefully we defend our corners in the building.

That's why I'm quite positive about the medical initiative started by Evans. If we stabilize Malden and Conrad and Caltech manages to revive EvilPerson (who is also close by), I'd be even carefully optimistic about the success of the mission. Question remains if and how fast the troops outside the buiilding will rush us.

But that's something we can deal with then the time comes. By exiting the building through the south exit, we could flank them when they try to enter at K 35. If they disperse, we take them on one by one, if they concentrate on one point, it might get time for some grenade action.

I have to admit I just realised that [I]nfantry armour is totally impervious to pistol and SMG fire.

[E1] Pvt. Evans!Ac/akrMPao 2013/07/27(Sat)12:45 No. 74171 ID: e3aff6
File 137495431007.png - (22.22KB , 1537x267 , jcyds.png )

>>74162
T1 and M2 are at -2 out of -3 health, meaning that they will die if not stabilized this turn. I am to far to stabilize more than one of them, so one of them is guaranteed to 'die' unless M1 comse help them which, because I think the enemies have vision in the yellow room (I need to ask to confirm this) would put M1 is T range and therefore doom us all. I am currently in favor of saving M2, because once he is back up we will no longer be completely done for if one medic goes down.


The bit about vision brings me to a question: Corners, how do they work?
Attached is an image with four scenarios of soldiers looking through an open doorway from different positions/facings. If you have time, please mark the squares that can be seen in each scenario.
(I don't want to be demanding, but I think this isn't the first time there has been corner-looking confusion, so I would like to have something to use for future reference rather than just asking about a specific case.)

>>74171
Wait, nevermind, we did see an example of most of this this earlier (>>522112) and I forgot.

Anonymous 2013/07/27(Sat)14:33 No. 74178 ID: a01b62
File 137496079969.png - (27.22KB , 1537x267 , vision.png )

>>74171
This should illustrate the rules I try to follow.

One of our [T]s should definitely work towards Clairvoyant. It sounds like it would help scouting/planning immensely.

>>74176
Good observation, missed that.

>>74178
Oh, okay. The "head poking around corner" vision is not like I expected.

>>74181
UAVs. Implant Corps. Force field generators.
No IR goggles anywhere.

>>74178
Thanks! Is it ok if I put this in the codex section on the wiki for future reference?

Anonymous 2013/07/27(Sat)18:15 No. 74193 ID: a01b62
File 137497412260.png - (27.64KB , 1537x267 , vision.png )

>>74182
Promotions, my good man, spec into those goggles and taste sweet victory.

Also, I may have made a mistake with the 'head poking around corner' one, you're right; he should be able to see everything in front of and left of the door.

>>74187
Here it is fixed.

Just to get confirmation, a [S]'s move or act restriction includes non-class actions like stabilizing, right?

>>74196
Unfortunately, yes, stabilizing requires ACT.

[I1] Pvt. Eli Minativik 2013/07/29(Mon)03:54 No. 74257 ID: 2bef4c
File 137509526656.png - (399.81KB , 1000x2000 , not_actually_a_plan.png )

< not the actual situation

We have 4 kills. We could, in theory, get 2 troopers as reinforcements.

Are some of our fallen willing to join as with secondary characters? (since this is a training mission, your primary characters are not dead and keep their rank)

Or even some new recruits ?

I don't know how the rest of the team feels, but I think we can still turn this around, despite the odds.

>>74257
Since it's a training mission, I would allow you to redeploy the people who died.

>>74257
I have [T]Pvt. Nitan and [I]Pvt. Gaston to deploy. Both are likely more useful than Suggestion for proceeding in close-quarters through the building.

>>74270
I think a robust infantry unit would be a great asset right now, but whatever you choose, we'd be glad to have you back.

>>74275
Yeah, I'd say have the officer deploy some good, solid [I] units.

Sign up in the main thread and I'll toss you in. Though in all honesty, this officer gig isn't my cup of tea I think. I'll serve as long I'm the only one, but I'd like to get down onto the field!

Actually I have been kind of considering officering. I have been noticing an urge to tell others what to do in the thread fairly often. (Of course, the times I turned about to be right have not been as often...)

[E1] should be able to see along the wall, but spoilers: There's nothing there anyway.

>>74291
So that means I can see all those squares in the room above row 29 except N27 and M26, all of which contain nothing including doors?

>>74293
There is a door through Q26 to R26 and you can't see M26 or N27. To be precise.

>>74294
The door is closed I guess?

>>74297
Yep.

>>74289 >>74287
You guys could switch positions or something like that. Or Zaelix can deploy as reinforcement and Evans gets a on-the-field promotion and remote controls his character from now on (just for this mission, it's just trainign after all).

>>74332
Not until the end of the mission.

>>/quest/529880
So, [R]ocketeer Evilperson is now officially resurrected as an [I]nfantryman?

>>74402
No, Suggestion is. EvilPerson is still alive.

>>74417
I think he is referring to how Evilperson's map icon is now an [I] icon instead of a [R] icon.

Oh, dang, I have no idea how I missed that. Damn map glitches.

People in smoke clouds are effectively untargetable by bullets or [T]elekinesis but can still be hit by explosives launched at the smoke squares, right?

>>74701
yup, though I do believe the rules were slightly modified so that you can see something right next to you to prevent infinite blocks

>>74701
>>74703
It's a LOS blocker, not a forcefield. You can even spot for somebody outside the smokescreen so they can shoot/telepath them.

Are sniper mines safe for all friendlies, or just the sniper who placed them?
Also, if a sniper is right next to somebody can they drop a mine on them (either to attack an enemy or to place it in an ally's space if mines don't friendly fire)?

>>74714
Codex says "a sniper cannot activate his own mine" - which would indicate for me that all others do.

In the recent update (>>/quest/532747), by line of sight rules we can sprint our entire force (aside from I4) right up behind them without them knowing we are there (and therefore being unable to attack next turn) there unless we open fire, right?

>>74886
Yes, though keep in mind you'd have to avoid that turret and go all the way around/through the building. Can't walk through hostiles.

>>74728
Seems likely.

For future reference (it would not be a good idea to try at the moment), do failed attacks reveal your location the same way successful ones do?

>>74889
Any failed attack will leave the bullet tracer (but not show you) to alert the other side that they are being fired upon from out of view.

And now that [S1] has Leeroyed (well, as much as a sniper can and still attack), this brings up a curious situation. If I hadn't placed a force wall and the [I] runs west to shoot at [S2], would I get hit from being unrevealed but directly between his shooting position and his target he can see?

>>74891
Sorry, I thought I made it clear: It alerts them to your presence. It does not reveal you. They still can't attack you because they don't have sight on you this turn.

>>74892
You answered my question about missed attacks, but [S1] hit the [T] (unless the wall got in the way, which I don't think it quite does). Do successful attacks (or specifically successful attacks that kill the target) also not reveal your position?

>>74896
it does not.

If you can't see someone you can't shoot. The only thing that allows you to see someone is yourself or an ally directly facing them.

All shooting someone does is allow the person to know the direction the bullet came from. Which means I1 can shoot that infantry this turn, and next turn without fear of return fire. Its not until the THIRD turn that we can expect that infantry to start firing back.

>>74899
Oh, I see. I had somehow gotten the impression that succesfully getting a hit revealed you for attack. I am not sure exactly where I got that idea now that I think about it.

The ability to spot to shoot in at people in a smoke screen means you can also spot for people in the smoke to shoot out, right?

>>75039
yes

When it says that smoke grenades last three turns, that is three turns from full deployment (the 3x3) rather than three turns from the initial throw, right?

>>75200
I have the dire feeling I will find out next turn.

>>75200
The former, yes. Three turns to spread, three turns to dissipate.

[I1] Pvt. Eli Minativik 2013/08/18(Sun)23:38 No. 75352 ID: 09c9d6
File 137689429447.png - (29.26KB , 322x560 , mgs.png )

I have a question:

Would the enemy unit see the infantry sprint past like in this image? Is it aware of the move even if it is not able to attack next turn (has to spot first)?

>>75352
No. Like the players, the enemy can only see final positions. I try to operate off what they would know.

So I guess now is the time to discuss transferring [O]fficer status?

If you want it, now's the time to mention it.
Me, I'm going to be serving as a Medic, since I spent so much time botting Caltech...I think it was Caltech, at least.
So, characters I have:
[O] Zaealix (currently going back for more [O]fficer training)
[M] Alister (currently active.)
Thinking of getting a [T] or [R] as the 'alternate' class I use. Not decided which one yet.

I think I will keep with being an [E] for the next mission, to see how things go with the 'NPC' commander.

What a crazy mission.

Things that really did us in:
- new guys (like me) being unfamiliar with the mechanics
In the beginning, we thought squad Alpha could take advantage of the soft cover on the map.
Then squad Beta decided to let a medic and a Telekinetic scout ahead when both aren't frontline troops.

Although, in general, we rolled rather well, the times when we did not roll well really hurt. Our rocketeers especially. We had groups of enemies, beautifully clumped together, but were not able to take advantage of that. In the end, it was almost like everybody held his breath when a rocketeer took aim.

After we retreated into the building, I think really pulled ourselves together. We advanced very carefully, maybe even a bit too slow, we discussed more etc.
In the end, the battle for the flag was really balanced imho. We healed, we took positions, we threw smoke... it was good. We turned the ratio of damage taken vs damage dealt around in our favour, despite being slightly outnumbered. Maybe the enemy rolled really badly in the end, I'm not sure.

When we got reckless, we got punished. When we kept a cool head, with a bit of luck, we did them in. It is true that Agt. Azure carried us hard, but it was a symbiotic relationship - we scouted, he popped heads. We could have done that for while and basically lay siege to them, but we all wanted to end the mission quickly.

Now the new recruits that survived until the end really know the mechanics, how line of sight works, how to clear rooms, that opening doors doesn't cost move etc. I hope as many as possible stay.

Despite what HQ might say, I leave the training compounds with an optimistic feeling.

One last thing: I had the feeling that we were very support-heavy, lots of low HP troopers, with useful abbilities, but out team was a bit squishy overall.

>>75502
I agree with everything this man said.

>>75502
Honestly we had a pretty good mix at the start. The big problem was most of them died when we got ambushed and stayed in the killzone.

That enemy sniper at the time had crazy range if you look at it. He was shooting 3-4 over his natural range and hitting every time. If he had missed once or twice we might have fared MUCH better.

>>75522
Dude just kept rolling 10's.