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File 155826081464.png - (44.41KB , 600x400 , dungeoneer_ch6.png )
933337 No. 933337 ID: e8f59c

http://www.tgchan.org/wiki/Dungeoneer

It feels as if I've been running from problem to problem since waking up. But we're slowly digging in and slowly making progress.
387 posts omitted. Last 100 shown. Expand all images
>>
No. 947580 ID: 43b08a

I think Fecund makes the most sense. More interesting golems and a general productivity boost to get our production in gear.

Cursed sounds very fun and thematic, but I think the denizens have had enough curses for now.
>>
No. 947583 ID: 7ebbf9
File 157173920290.png - (31.50KB , 800x600 , make_like_a_tree_and_fruit.png )
947583

>So are any of the bones in here useful for crafting material or not so much?
They're just frogs, lizards and other creatures.

>Considering the bomb flowers and mushrooms, we were already kinda moving into a plant direction. And now we even have an oreberry bush. Wonderful, what a great find.
I would always attempt to make use of the natural resources around my dungeon, this is more a decision of focus.

>What's an oreberry?
It's a cave dwelling bush that grows in stone and slowly produces metallic berries. This one's a copper oreberry. The leaves contain a small amount of tin as well, but that's much more annoying to extract.

>Chaos: Deem, you're already dealing with weird shit all the time you you clearly do not like it. With your luck? A constant stream of bizarre problems. That said, the options it opens up are limitless- but do you really want to live that life?
I'm not a coward. Risk is a necessary element of progress.

>Fecund lets what we already have develop better and faster, and if we really want variety it should with some interesting new monsters. Plus, plant golems are amazing, nearly as cool as planting plants inside slimes. (Which we can do! it's a side effect of the healing stuff they can secrete, it just hasn't come up yet.)
It's true I haven't been making full use of what I have yet. I need to plant the mushrooms, the bomb flower and see what assistance the slimes can give to this. Fecund it is then.

>Hmm, see, fecund seems farthest from the aesthetic you've been cultivating, and it seems like aesthetic matters here.
It isn't something I have pursued much in the past no. But I think a clean break from the past is what I need.

>The dryad form Deem is using right now looks rad. Stone intermingled with plant seems cool.
Perhaps I will retain a little of this look then.

>Who knows? This might also help that little red slime survive and not die from having an extremely frail existence.
You shouldn't let yourself get attached. Merud has finished his prototype and Reisarf has apparently abandoned whatever he was thinking of to bolster that slime back at the dungeon. It will probably die no matter what I do.
>>
No. 947584 ID: 7ebbf9
File 157173937746.png - (25.68KB , 720x640 , dungeon_speedrun_strat.png )
947584

>Since it'll help denizens develop, this would help Merud develop his skills whenever you help him with his research and when you tutor him in golem making.
It doesn't help develop knowledge. It promotes growth. The plant compatibility will be of interest to him at least.

>Fecund since it has the highest chance of leading to my dream of a horrible poison fungus quagmire section invaders have to endure.
While that isn't outside the realm of the possible, were you not listening when I outlined a type of dungeon that specialises in piling afflictions upon invaders?

>Safe, stable development and symbiosis!
>Cursed sounds very fun and thematic, but I think the denizens have had enough curses for now.
People don't go to dungeons for safety. In fact my dungeon has been lacking in danger in many respects thus far!

That has to change! Since I will be able to enlarge my workforce again with this new wealth of gold, I also will have to raise my ambitions for the expansion of my dungeon.

The current layout is functional but extremely basic. The only challenge I through at invaders is my denizens. There's no puzzles, traps, secret areas or obstacles to delay them, save for the pool in the Thaumatorium, which is some swimming at worst.

Invaders enter through the tunnel to the outside, pass through the Golem Totem and into the hall. They can go left into the Forge and discover the locked door to my final guardian or go right and get the key they need from the Thaumatorium.

The rest of the dungeon is inaccessible to them, though I will at least have one new feature with the potion dispenser which can dispense the new Brewery's products into the Thaumatorium.
>>
No. 947585 ID: 7ebbf9
File 157173948192.png - (39.70KB , 800x1150 , map_is_still_one_level.png )
947585

The inaccessible parts of the dungeon for the valley access are substantial and include the new Meditation Room and Treasury. I won't be able to create any more denizen-only areas until I have improved the layout.

I also will be transporting more excavated material out, attract receptive wild monsters to live here and import soil and plants. I need to create a decent thoroughfare. Perhaps even dig a new primary entrance.

I need more large chambers for monster lairs; Alkaline's slimes first of all. Once I have at least one, I can give thought to other structures for the use of my denizens or for me to to begin exerting more control over the wilds around my dungeon. Such rooms have few restrictions in format, which brings me to the primary requirement for now.

The first step is a plan for adding a number of rooms and how to string them together with the older diggings to set the pace for how invaders progress through them. A rough layout at least, with some thoughts of what threats and obstacles they can present to invaders. If necessary, I can make radical alterations to the arrangement and orientation of rooms the next time I cast Delve.
>>
No. 947586 ID: 094652

One tip I can recommend is that ease lowers some peoples' guards while optimizing others'. For instance, if you create shortcuts back to the entrance that can only be opened after the adventurers have progressed through a complex area, that will basically say 'okay, you accomplished something yaaay, now you can just take a few steps and leave', which invites recklessness because it cheapens the effort in cashing out, but also gives your wiser delvers an option to leave while they have the chance.

And there's something else you need to consider: we have an overhead map of the dungeon. Adventurers don't. They have to go through each room one at a time. So I'd suggest a puzzle room that is confusing if you can only remember your past three moves and the area they affect, but utterly simple to solve at an overhead glance.
>>
No. 947587 ID: ad51b8

hmm, the only suggestion I have right now is to use that little crack in the water room? Make some water filled tunnels About ankle to knee deep and have that be the main way to where we'd put Alkaline's boss room. This way we can have the slimes hide under the water for surprise attacks, have sudden pits also hidden by the water and maybe even some hidden underwater tunnels to let our minions sneak behind any adventuring party. Hell depending on how much water we can get going we could make that the maze part of the dungeon and make a serious of water halls and tunnels that lead to dead ends or to progress you need to find one of the hidden underwater tunnels to get to another part of the the water maze.

Other things I can think of is turning the open field area into a boss room and having the way leading up to that one be fulled with puzzles and having all the pathways met up at certain points with natural looking doors to block off certain areas so we can switch the dungeon up to keep it from becoming to same-y and so we can lock some of the large boss rooms if the boss of the day isn't up for a fight or needs time to rest or whatever.
>>
No. 947593 ID: a6e7d9
File 157175109911.png - (87.89KB , 800x1150 , Dungeon5.png )
947593

>>947585
Okay, so the trick here is gonna be that we need the dungeon to work as a dungeon, but we do also want it to be suitable for the day-to-day use of our dungeoneers.

Generally speaking, work/practice rooms should be deeper into the dungeon to give our residents time to prepare when invaders show up. They also shouldn't be on the main thoroughfare - people shouldn't have to navigate magic practice to get around, and Hin shouldn't have to put up with foot traffic through her forge while she's working. Hin's forge specifically is likely to be somewhat loud, so it shouldn't be directly connected to anything that will see frequent use.

Monster rooms are probably best placed closer to the front? They shouldn't need as much prep time when adventurers show up, and it's probably a good idea to make sure they don't have to tromp through too much of the dungeon to get outside to hunt or whatever.

And if we're going with the garden/monster/growth/whatever theme, we really should have some kinda large plant-ey centerpiece to match. Underground trees always look cool, especially if we can get some sunlight in there from a skylight or some kinda magic/mirror shenanigans. And, like, a lot of plants tend to like sunlight, and it'd be convenient to have the option to grow them inside the dungeon.

So the plan would be to break the dungeon up into a front half and back half separated by a puzzle door. The front half houses monster lairs and other ablative rooms that contain clues/hints or necessary elements for the puzzle door. The back half contains the work/practice areas of the dungeon, and two keys to a boss door that requires both to open. Hallways and a central hub will give us space to cleanly expand outward.

That, along with a couple of secret doors linking the front and back, should provide plenty of time to prep when adventurers do arrive, and it should also give everyone a reasonably good chance of being roughly where we'll want them to set up fights in a sensible order.
>>
No. 947596 ID: 3ce8ff

>>947593
i like the layout but i'm not sure how viable it is to move everything like that given how much trouble we have with basic room creation
>>
No. 947598 ID: ce39da

Connecting the larger of the two crags in the hall with the crag at the end of the thaumatorium with a short series of rooms will do wonders for counterbalancing the layout, and will also reduce the MDB (Mandatory Direct Backtracking) considerably. Play around with more natural-looking configurations now that we're aiming for a fecund theme. Perhaps have an underwater shortcut between the middlemost room and the thaumatorium (which will still have the boss key, but perhaps adventurers can only approach from the back unless they find a regular key?)
>>
No. 947604 ID: d27448

>>947593
This is an excellent goal to work towards, I like this layout a lot.
>>
No. 947608 ID: 28edc4

>>947593
that looks nice, but it would mean moving around some rooms which would be.. a challenge.

also, the denizen-only rooms should be completely inaccessible, not just behind a secret door.
and i don't know how much would charcoal like his lair being so close to the action, it would mean he'll lost all his gold every encounter.

hmm.. what else. oh! right, we need to delay them enough at the entrance for everyone to get into position. first priority might be a puzzle door before the first room.
>>
No. 947609 ID: b1b4f3

>>947584
>were you not listening when I outlined a type of dungeon that specialises in piling afflictions upon invaders?
I wanted the afflictions to be specifically delivered via plants and fungi. Would a Cursed dungeon be more closely attuned to that?
Also I can't tell if you/we decided on one of the specializations yet.

>>947593
I don't like this. First off, it requires us to completely restructure the layout rather than reuse already-dug areas. Deem SPECIFICALLY said for us to reuse areas. Secondly, it does not force invaders into a specific path, so we can't predict where they will be going to send our defenders there. Thirdly, we can't rely on secret doors to lockdown the dungeon when invaders are present. They have to be Sealed doors if we want to prevent invaders from going through them.
>>
No. 947610 ID: 1774cd
File 157177282936.png - (2.80KB , 243x203 , minor edit.png )
947610

>>947593
Minor edit. Enhances usability and tactical options.
>>
No. 947631 ID: 0fae41
File 157178858215.png - (88.66KB , 1000x1438 , diggy diggy farm.png )
947631

Evidently, to control the route we can split the key into separate parts and hide them down separate branches. Backtracking will help extend dungeon run time and shouldn't be too annoying at this point.

To assist in the construction of rooms further in, first we'll have to expand the entryway into the golem totem with a hall nearly as wide as the chamber itself. The door should become a double door, too.

Give the left end of the hallway a second branch opposite the forge, and route the boss entrance through that side. This means less thoroughfare through the forge for Hin during construction, and a chance to work in peace. Maybe the key needs to be literally reforged in the forge! You'll need some sort of cast for adventurers to do so in - and this might even come in handy for re-breaking the key. Sure, the key could just snap together, but requiring the forge means another place they have to visit, and you could induce extra complications into the process of pouring the metal.

To start off. you can start several new rooms from the imp excavations: one past the pool for the slime pit (for easy water access), then a mushroom/plant life garden, followed by a monster den for the second path. The den is perhaps a collection of many small burrows. A minion-only door between the slime chamber and the warrens is acceptable, right? So you don't have to swim across every time you want to hug a slime.
Fourth, in front of the boss room, put a hazardous puzzle room which can be turned off at the far end... mostly. You get three times the uses out of a pit trap if they have to jump/swing across every time! The Indiana Jones combination of spinning waist-high blades, a reading comprehension test and a 'leap of faith' (i.e. how minions get across) is a good combo to start.
Finally, put an underwater secret room in the flooded imp excavation. No indication of it above the surface, but below the waterline an easily dislodged grate with treasure behind. Waterproof treasure, preferably.

Building priority: 1) puzzle room, 2) garden, 3) warrens, 4) slime chamber, 5) secret room.
>>
No. 947633 ID: 0fae41

As for the dryad look, it's a nice costume but the look is, shall we say, seasonal. I was thinking you might delegate the look to some minion golems instead. Perhaps treants to tend and guard the gardens?
>>
No. 947634 ID: fadca3

I would like to add that the dungeon exists in 3 dimensions, not just 2, so we could have stairs leading up or down (down would probably he easier) to additional rooms. This might help with space constraints.
Additionally, the slimes have very malleable bodies, so we could have thin passages between rooms that no adventurer could move through, but any slimes could. Like, there could be a trap room that seems empty, but upon being entered locks the exit and has slimes pour in from gaps in the walls.
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No. 947639 ID: 09e13b

>>947634
Building on this: would it be possible to use delve to construct a maze of some sort? More specifically, a maze with small openings (Holes? Slits?) in the walls that adventurers couldn't fit through, but slimes COULD? A maze where adventures have to stumble around looking for a path through while the enemy can just pass through walls seems like a really cool setup. Good for hit-and-run tactics and ambushes, and it'll work well with the shadow-slick based slimes we're going to be getting eventually.

>>947631
I like this layout a lot in general, but the garden room you drew looks really cramped to me with those close little rows of planters. Not much room to fight in, and almost certain to have the plants knocked over or damaged. (Of course, it may be that any any open-to-the-public garden we have will have to be for show only because of the risk of it getting trashed.) Maybe the garden could be a semicircular room instead of long thin one, with the straight wall being against the thaumatorium? That could also let us have irrigation channels fed from the thaumatorium pool...
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No. 947646 ID: b1b4f3
File 157179949041.png - (77.27KB , 800x1150 , dungeon.png )
947646

Alright here's a layout I made, it's a bit messy but it does what I want to do for now.
The red doors are locked when an adventurer shows up, which forces them to go through the right side of the dungeon. There's combat or a puzzle in the thaumatorium, then after that's dealt with they have to pull a lever that drains the water into the secondary chamber there so they can continue. The path leads to a poison-themed section that tries its best to kill or at least weaken the invaders in preparation for the rest of the dungeon. The initial winding passage is mostly just dumping toxic fumes and spores on the adventurers, there's no monsters or traps just a hostile environment. If they survive that it's assumed they have some manner of protection from breathing toxins. The skull room houses poison-themed monsters that will dunk the invaders into poison pools or inject venom, rather than passively debilitating them. The grid-shaped room is not really a grid. It's a maze that gets set randomly every time invaders show up, by closing doors or moving walls or whatever's convenient for Deem. It's got poison and/or acid in it and various traps, just to see if the invaders can endure a long period of that attack vector.
The following rooms along the path I just put in to fill space and balance out the rest of the dungeon. They can be puzzles or trap rooms or combat challenges.
I tried to have a roomy corridor through the middle for the requested thoroughfare, but access to the poisonous rooms should be restricted just for the comfort of our denizens. Also, the golem totem room is enlarged so it's easier to move through.
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No. 947648 ID: b1b4f3

>>947646
Oh and I moved the boss chamber up closer to the valley to make room. Hin's forge should still have a smoke outlet, but it could instead outlet towards the front entrance instead of the rear...
Also I didn't put many doors in, those need to be added.

Oops, ignore the green lock. I thought about having two keys but it isn't needed with this layout.
>>
No. 947669 ID: 0fae41

>>947639
A sort of garden ampitheater could almost be a kind of miniboss chamber. Given that a specific structure exists to fuel such rooms, perhaps that structure would also end up useful for feeding the flora in the room.
>>
No. 947692 ID: ce39da

>>947631
On a general level, this is exactly the kind of addition I was thinking of to snap two of the loose crags together. We could also turn the lesser crag in the hall into a door to a more robust entrance, while the underwater crag in the Thaumatorium could be turned into an underwater entrance to a secret room with a bonus treasure hidden behind a bunch of obscuring plants (two layers of hiddenness as the puzzle).

Personally, the other two illustrated layouts have too many connecting hallways; that usually amounts to dead space in a dungeon.
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No. 947715 ID: 0fae41
File 157186576581.png - (67.55KB , 1001x707 , What_if_it_was_rounder.png )
947715

>>947639
>>947692
Totally didn't just forget hallways were a thing you could build, no sir.
Hallways aren't allways dead space - they're a great place to put traps where adventurers won't have much space to move around! A hall in front of the monster den could be filled with the typical arrow holes, a rolling boulder, or even a spring trap that throws them forward - they'll never see that coming!
If we dig up, it would also be a good place to put our pancake golem as a falling trap when he is retired in favor of a less improvised door.
>>
No. 947761 ID: 2eba1a

Im not really a layout design person so i'll leave that to the ones that are, but I have thought of some room features that might be useful:
-Now that Alkaline has started birthing slimes, maybe we can start adding small secret tunnels connecting some rooms, the kind only the slimes can really get through so they can quickly move from room to room, and maybe set up ambushes?
-if we're going to start doing plant stuff in earnest, maybe we should see about getting some useful moss to grow in the dungeon, maybe some algae for the water sections. I hear the latter is apparently good for food?
-Someone else mentioned utilizing the hallways for puzzle and traps, which I think is a good idea. Theres no real reason they have have to be straight shots between rooms either. Linking some hallways into other hallways to complicate the circuit through the dungeon for first timers might be a simple way to work the next construction into a pseudo puzzle, and we can add more stuff to them later, like minor keys for doors in the hallways and give them to the minions, the purpose of which is just to create shortcuts through the rooms. Really Dark Souls it up. Halls also seem to be much easier and faster to make then rooms as well.
-on a minor aesthetic note, now that we dont have the bear to worry about, Deem should be able to get some lumber, at leat someof it quality enough to get some wood floors or paneling for the denizen section of the dungeon. Polished stone is fine and all, but im sure some of the minions would like a more home-y look to the living space. Might be warmer too, but magic might be taking care of that.
>>
No. 947789 ID: 09e13b

>>947715
Nice! That's more or less what I was thinking, thank you for drawing it. ^^ Is there a reason the slime room is a heart now, or was it just a way yo make it bigger? (I'm probably going to vote for the slime room to be a maze if it's an option, but you don't specify what's in there so it works regardless.)

>>947761
Regarding sneaky slime tunnels: These would be really great to have, but I'm not entirely sure how we're supposed to build them. I guess we could make a very, very small golem for the express purpose of building tiny tunnels, but otherwise I suspect we'll only be able to create them via Delve, not my ordinary mining.
Regarding moss: That would be a really cool look! Also, the magic eating mushrooms glow, right? Glowing mushrooms would be a nice addition to the aesthetic. I know you have to raise them in a certain way for them to be useful, but there's no reason we can't plant a few extra ones around just for decoration right? (I'm not sure about algae in the pool, though, it might come off as just dirty rather than organic. Maybe Lilly pads?)
>>
No. 947791 ID: 977456

>>947789
Heart? That is clearly a tactical funnel, in which the challengers enter into a cramped space while the slimes have open terrain from which to engage unhindered. It most assuredly isn't a symbol of maternal feelings from a Dungeon towards a clearly terrifying monarch of monsters.
>>
No. 947794 ID: 91ee5f

Can we at least agree on not leaving Deem’s heart in the boss room? A stray attack could hit it and damage it further!

And if the adventurers manage to defeat out boss, they might think Deem’s heart is part of the treasure they’re allowed to take and try to take it!
>>
No. 947795 ID: 977456

>>947794
What? No! Deem needs to be there to enjoy witness the final battle! And glare at the thieving thieves honour their victory. What sort of ignorant fool could fail to recognise the majesty and sanctity of such a noble overseer of The Labyrinth Game?
>>
No. 947800 ID: 8d23f0

>>947463
Chaos seems the best for fighting Sky eventually
>>
No. 947818 ID: 10c408

>>947794
if it was that easy to break, then it would have most likely been destroyed during the millennia of strife that Deem slept through.

That she doesn't exactly know her own point of origin or the exact composition of the dungeon heart is worrying, but not nearly as bad as the fact that someone or something using sky power damaged her heart and cursed her to sleep forever.
>>
No. 947828 ID: 12b116

>>947583
Don't forget to make an extra chamber to store that enormous ass you've accumulated.
>>
No. 947834 ID: 977456

>>947828 You know, she really ought to look into a proper system for waste expulsion. Industries usually produce useless byproducts, experiments and curses gone awry need holding facilities, and let's not forget how she keeps gorging on Earth-Pulse, overpressurising on mana, then expelling a cloud of monsters to stink up the mountain. What sort of rooms control wild spawns, and can overall dungeon structure affect such?
>>
No. 947837 ID: 094652

>>947834
How about combining a 'collapsing lair' trap with waste disposal? Rooms in the shortest path to the exit will periodically open to gaping holes... that are actually mulching rooms for your party to dump all their garbage in, where it is quickly processed by tectonic plate shifts or molten lava or simple block pressing.

Yes, the self-destructing dungeon trope is utterly cliche, but it works well in video games. Successful adventurers have to choose between concentrating their efforts towards escaping with stragglers left behind, or keeping everyone alive at the risk of losing it all in the final stretch. And since we know that only a portion of the rooms are actually self-collapsing, we can set up ambushes in further rooms while the adventurers are escaping through a single predetermined short path!
>>
No. 947840 ID: 09e13b

>>947837
We do have to, you know, live there afterward. Anything we break we need to put back together, and considering the dungeon is also a shared living space...
>>
No. 947868 ID: 8d4593

Have we actually locked in a direction yet? Because only one of us mentioned our elements and how they might interact when we were discussing it.

Fecund is practical and Cursed is cool, but when considering the Synergistic effects Chaos could have on an Earth/Shadow element dungeon, I think we can make a stronger case for it, particularly in dungeon layout.

It sounds to me like the kind of combo that could allow looping puzzle hallways, doors that lead to different places for different people, endless staircases, illusory passages, countless traps, and on the fly room swapping. Imagine if the dungeon was totally normal for our denizens but a scooby-doo style "Funhouse" for invaders. Numbers would mean nothing, and by the time they find a fight they'd be exhausted, and alone.
>>
No. 947871 ID: a9af05

>>947868
You're a little late for that. Deem has already decided on Fecund.

Right now we're trying to make a decision on how we should arrange dungeon's layout.
>>
No. 947880 ID: 977456

Thought: I would love to see slimes scurrying around plants, but... I think people use fire against slimes. Using fire against our farm would be unfortunate, even if Deem can miraculously repair it afterwards. Finally, I am not sure how much sensitivity Deem's body has, but I imagine that a fireball hitting a cute little array of bomb plants all ready to bloom might... give her indigestion. Although it could be that her body is completely numb. I haven't heard anything about going to town on her with pickaxes to dig new corridors being a thing that stimulates any of her nerve-equivalents.

So keep the farm and slimes separate?
>>
No. 947884 ID: 09e13b

>>947880
Plants can be planted inside slimes, according to the original description of one of Alkaline's abilities. I think part of letting the slimes 'help out' is doing stuff like putting a bomb flower inside a slim to give it explosive ammo and/or let protect the plant from adventurers.

...Also, would fire be useful against slimes? I'm no expert, but aren't they mostly made of water? It seems like they'd be resistant if anything.
>>
No. 947887 ID: a29e83

>>947593
i vote this with the edit adding more doors
>>
No. 947914 ID: 2eba1a

>>947887
I agree, as long as we also add more locks and keys. They dont even have to be magical, or particularly complex, just make them enough so that any party without a rogue cant just power through them without a lot of work, and hopefully expending some energy.
Also, Door Golem is an example for us all. Make one as a split door, give em some teeth, and theres a tricky trap ready to chomp down when they least expect it.

>>947794
You know, thinking about this, if we dont move the Heart out of that room, can we not build around it? As in, build it into a more protected feature of the room? For instance, building a big impressive looking pillar around it. I think the heart gives of some light, so if we make some apertures and have the heart be high up the pillar, the glow should coe through and it will seem like just a cool feature of the dungeon to any adventurers. Or we could put it behind some kind of motif on one of the walls with some kind of opening only Deem can reliably operate.
Basically, just thinking if we build a protective feature the right way and make it fit in with the boss room, maybe adventurers wont even think twice to look for it/at it.
>>
No. 947954 ID: 09e13b

>>947914
If I recall correctly, the actual material of the Heart is almost indestructible. That's why having a mysterious chunk knocked out of it is so weird. The main risk is it getting knocked off/out of its mounting, since the heart getting disconnected from the dungeon is Extremely Bad for Deem's health. So really we'd want to half embed it in something, or maybe just invest in sturdy stone or metal clamps to hold it in place.

I suspect that trying to damage the Heart of a dungeon is a pretty severe breach of the rules of the Dungeon Game, though.
>>
No. 947957 ID: 977456

Deem has always maintained that invaders will be sufficiently honourable that they wouldn't steal a lady's heart. That said, security options exist.
An arm thrusting from the ground, clutching Deem's heart would be evocative, but imply that Deem is being held by the dungeon, instead of the reverse. More accurately it would be Deem handling herself, but that wouldn't be the obvious message.
Hanging from the roof in a lacy tea strainer would be fun, but would involve a vulnerable chain and less contact with Earth.
A stalagmite and stalactite meeting would be symbolic, but lot elegant, and Deem... could be compared to a classy lady.
Statuary of fortresses, cultists, houses... all too culturally human...
Crystals are nice! It could be really pretty to have a big crystal (quartz should be easy enough to generate?) with a transparent polish and light refracting from pure mana flowing through some channels...
But this is all beside the point. Being confined like that would be icky, and invaders would never dare to take a giant magical gem, and Deem can probably resist quite a lot of force once she's aestablished and has a good grip on The Earth Pulse.
>>
No. 948043 ID: 2eba1a

>>947957
>>invaders would never dare to take a giant magical gem
I somehow highly doubt this assertion.
Anyway, I think it would only confining if we do it some way that Deem herself couldnt get it out whenever she wants. It should be pretty easy to avoid that and then it would be more like a comfortable cuddle, but with like, rocks and stuff!
>>
No. 948091 ID: 2adab5

>Structure to build the heart into
Sculpt a big stone eye into the ceiling with the heart as the center. At the end of the boss fight the eye closes, dramatically signifying the fight is over while also making the heart more secure. There is a potential issue of adventurers trying to shoot it, but the heart is very durable so the problem is more stealing than attacking.
>>
No. 948114 ID: 7ebbf9
File 157226891897.png - (74.98KB , 800x1150 , fancy_new_dungeon.png )
948114

A number of details to refine but this should only need a single Delve to relocate the Forge, Thaumatorium and Brewery, and be usable at various stages of its excavation. I can repurpose my current Heart Chamber and move my Heart deeper inside once the chance arises. I will need to move the Treasury again though.

Blue for normal doors, red for doors that will remain sealed during an invasion and the rest tied to keys.

>The plan would be to break the dungeon up into a front half and back half separated by a puzzle door. The front half houses monster lairs and other ablative rooms that contain clues/hints or necessary elements for the puzzle door. The back half contains the work/practice areas of the dungeon.
Sensible to slow down an invader and herd everyone else to where they need to be.

Currently I think I will put a single key in the new south-east room set aside to be the lair for Alkaline and her slimes. More complexity can be added to the front half of the dungeon once the new arrangements are settled.

>And if we're going with the garden/monster/growth/whatever theme, we really should have some kinda large plant-ey centerpiece to match.
I'll put that in as a hub for the back half of the dungeon. I will need to find some interesting plants for it.

>Play around with more natural-looking configurations now that we're aiming for a fecund theme.
Perhaps a more natural look for the slime pit and pencil in a bathing room with a set of natural pools to replace the somewhat exposed current baths - its adjacency to the alchemical lab and the slime pit will end up being appreciated I'm sure.

>Additionally, the slimes have very malleable bodies, so we could have thin passages between rooms that no adventurer could move through, but any slimes could. Like, there could be a trap room that seems empty, but upon being entered locks the exit and has slimes pour in from gaps in the walls.
I'll trial it in the slime pit by having a number of puddles and a simple maze-like structure with narrow openings for them to hide in. I think between the hallway and the garden I might try some grates at the ceiling level to give them an unexpected way to move between the rooms.

>Connecting the larger of the two crags in the hall with the crag at the end of the thaumatorium with a short series of rooms will do wonders for counterbalancing the layout, and will also reduce the MDB (Mandatory Direct Backtracking) considerably.
I think this will end up being the last of the new diggings so I'll leave the plan vague for now, one unspecified large room and one space for a mushroom garden - given its isolation I might supplement the mushrooms I've gotten off Izakikk with more aggressive varieties. There's a one-way door to return adventurers to the central garden once they have the key to the final guardian.

>To control the route we can split the key into separate parts and hide them down separate branches. Backtracking will help extend dungeon run time and shouldn't be too annoying at this point.
I've only put in single keys but once the front and west wing get expanded on, that can be put into place.
>>
No. 948115 ID: 7ebbf9
File 157226901479.png - (46.76KB , 800x600 , fresh_golem.png )
948115

It's our last night here in the wild. We're getting an early start in the morning.

The bear pelt and other choice bits have been packed, Belphe filled with bear blood, the slimes stuffed full of bear meat and the rest buried.

While I have a moment to myself I've decided to make a new golem out of the surplus clay I brought. With this newfound gold we'll be wanting to scale up the workforce again.

>Don't forget to make an extra chamber to store that enormous ass you've accumulated.
The potion's worn off but I'll have plenty of space should the need arise.

>If we're going to start doing plant stuff in earnest, maybe we should see about getting some useful moss to grow in the dungeon, maybe some algae for the water sections. I hear the latter is apparently good for food?
I'll need some time to make space but I will need to start keeping more of an eye out for useful plants.

>On a minor aesthetic note, now that we don't have the bear to worry about, Deem should be able to get some lumber, at least some of it quality enough to get some wood floors or panelling for the denizen section of the dungeon. Polished stone is fine and all, but I'm sure some of the minions would like a more home-y look to the living space.
Variety would be good at the very least, yes. I'll need to get a party of lumberjacks together at some point.

>Regarding sneaky slime tunnels: These would be really great to have, but I'm not entirely sure how we're supposed to build them. I guess we could make a very, very small golem for the express purpose of building tiny tunnels.
Golems will do it. I'd be wary about overusing them though, adventurers can be very tricky sorts.

>You know, she really ought to look into a proper system for waste expulsion. Industries usually produce useless byproducts, experiments and curses gone awry need holding facilities, and let's not forget how she keeps gorging on Earth-Pulse, overpressurising on mana, then expelling a cloud of monsters to stink up the mountain. What sort of rooms control wild spawns, and can overall dungeon structure affect such?
I'll soon have the chance to start building structures for geomancy. That will allow me to alter and re-arrange the nearby terrain and affect what sort of monsters spawn in this region.

As for alchemy, I'll simply have a small sewer run under the slime pit that drains to the outside for now.
>>
No. 948116 ID: 7ebbf9
File 157226907028.png - (21.70KB , 800x600 , weird_dog_happy_to_see_you.png )
948116

The trip home is uneventful - Moriko and I do harass the frogs one last time while waiting for the golems to pack up the camp but there's less trouble slipping away this time.

>If I recall correctly, the actual material of the Heart is almost indestructible.
That's correct, as long as it contains mana it is exceedingly difficult to damage.

>If we don't move the Heart out of that room, can we not build around it? As in, build it into a more protected feature of the room? For instance, building a big impressive looking pillar around it.
Yes, I will want to eventually build a better scaffold for my Heart as the dungeon develops anyway.

>Deem has always maintained that invaders will be sufficiently honourable that they wouldn't steal a lady's heart.
They could try, but they would die.

We come in sight of my dungeon and Chakarchelou is the first of my denizens that we see. He gambols out with dog-like enthusiasm. I hope Merud hasn't been teaching him anything else weird while I wasn't watching.

Between the adventurer pair, the bear hoard and other minor income form digging and other monsters, I have 2,493G. Perhaps I should share some of my windfall with Chakarchelou? His current hoard is only a little over 100G and I thought the Covetous Ring would need at least twice that to start showing any real effect.

I need to keep at least 2,000G to reinforce my Heart and will want some money set aside for the next trip into town. I am expecting 100G from Liana when I give her the repaired Fixity Bangle and I suppose I might be able to sell other items or otherwise raise money while in town.
>>
No. 948120 ID: c9c450

Give Char 150 right now as a present. You can give him more later, maybe, if you have change after the shopping trip.
>>
No. 948122 ID: 33056f

Give Chak another 200 gold and chin scratches, each.
Reabsorb your proxy golem into your main golem and see how the dungeon has fared in your wanderings.
>>
No. 948123 ID: 8d4593

Give Chak 143 gold to even the amount to a nice even number.
>>
No. 948124 ID: 3ce8ff

give him 193 and make a habit of rounding down to even 100s when you think about it to give to Chakarchelou so he has somewhat consistent income that is still solidly less than ours
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No. 948132 ID: 91ee5f

>>948116
>We come in sight of my dungeon and Chakarchelou is the first of my denizens that we see. He gambols out with dog-like enthusiasm. I hope Merud hasn't been teaching him anything else weird while I wasn't watching.
I think he’s always been like that, you’ve just never noticed until now.

Or he’s only happy to see you because he smells all the gold you’re carrying and is wanting you to give him some.

>Perhaps I should share some of my windfall with Chakarchelou? His current hoard is only a little over 100G and I thought the Covetous Ring would need at least twice that to start showing any real effect.
Well if he needs at least 200G, then go ahead and give him enough gold so that he has at least 200G.
>>
No. 948136 ID: ce39da

>>948124
I agree with this.

>>948114
Ooooh, this layout is deliciously elegant. The only urgent modification I'd make to this plan would be to reverse the pathing in the east wing by swapping the one-way door to the thaumatorium's southwest exit instead of the garden's northeast - the "front" and "back" of this room are a matter of perspective in my opinion. It'd be much easier to force them into a fight if the only other exits are across the room, and the thaumatorium feels like a much better miniboss room to place the boss key in. The reason I suggest the southwest door of the thaumatorium instead of the west exit of the middle-most mystery room after it is to give the delvers more initial options in the beginning; they go east from the garden hall, encounter a sealed door after clearing the room's main challenge, and wonder about what they'll do to end up coming at it from the other side. Also, if they clear the aforementioned room first, they might find that minor enemies have filled the vacuum upon their returning visit.

Finally, I have a suggestion for what this mystery room in question even is: While a Delve surge can definitely move the thaumatorium, I doubt one can simply move a void scar of darkness quite so easily, so I propose we leave it in its current geographic position, which places it very close to the center of this room; it will be "that room with the void scar."
>>
No. 948153 ID: b1b4f3

>>948116
Give Chakarchelou at least 150 gold.

Hey, what do you think would happen if we gave Worst Slime some raw mana? Less risky, try giving it some of Alkaline's slime. If we can't turn it into an Active Curse Elemental or something, we can at least try to turn it into more of a regular, stable slime.
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No. 948159 ID: 10c408

Give chak 75 gold now, and then another 75 gold later if he's done anything to warrant it. (it'd be a shame to have chak end up the same way as the dragon who never lost)
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No. 948166 ID: 977456

>>948124 +1
That layout seems good for now, but I worry longterm that hauling things from the entrance to the living regions will e a chore.

Check if any of the slimes found any gold. I expect they are prone to collecting shinies, so you never know.
Having some lights in the slime area might also be fun. I imagine that young slimes would get a great deal of enjoyment from standing on glowing lights to change their appearance.

Try not to let Char chew off too much of your horns.
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No. 948177 ID: a9af05

>>948116
Give Chak 193G.
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No. 948179 ID: 12b116

Give him 193g to make it an even number. Are you going to keep those sticks stuck in your head ?
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No. 948183 ID: 0a7f21

That's what happens when you choose a plant themed dungeon. Permanent horns.
>>
No. 948225 ID: 2eba1a

>>948183
We should have known Deem was getting horny.
It explains a lot about her behavior lately.
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No. 948232 ID: d6afc2

>>948116
In favor for the 193G and using Chars hoard to even our numbers.
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No. 948326 ID: 2adab5

>They could try, but they would die.
Uh, is your heart something they would be forced to leave behind when zipping directly back to one of those fancy new Revive Fountains?
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No. 948331 ID: 8d4593

>>948326
No the dungeon game is just that: a game. There are rules that both The dungeon and the players follow.
If you break the rules (Go into restricted areas, attack the dungeon core ect.), the dungeon can break them as well. I don't know how many adventurers could survive being DELVEd under thousands of tonnes of stone.
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No. 948335 ID: 09e13b

>>948114
Maybe this is standard practice for a larger dungeon, but it seems a bit odd the the former boss room and the hallway above it are entirely skippable under this design. Obviously its going to depend what we put in there, but not knowing if such a major feature will come up in invasions seems like a headache from a planning perspective. Possibly we could put a third key in there, and require both it and the one from the mushroom farm to access the final room? Or we could just put something there the adventurers would have some other incentive to visit, like one of those in-dungeon-potion-shops.

...Also, it currently looks like the resurrection room will be accessible to adventurers. Is it meant to be like that?
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No. 948381 ID: 977456

>>948331 Deem is an old hand and knows everything about The Labyrinth Game... of a couple of millennia back. She really ought to send someone in to spy on The Guild...
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No. 948410 ID: c3b417

>>948381
We don't have anyone capable of that.

They also don't know about us just yet and we also don't know how they'd respond to someone encroaching on their monopoly.
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No. 948465 ID: 2adab5

>I don't know how many adventurers could survive being DELVEd under thousands of tonnes of stone.
That's missing the point. If they die, the fountain (not us, and using new techniques since Deem's time) revive-teleports them back to town. If they die while holding our heart, either it is protected from teleportation or it goes with them as they instantly leave our domain.
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No. 948477 ID: 33056f

>>948465
If you need a refresher, the less time an adventurer has had an item the more likely it is not to follow them back to the fountain. You can't simply grab what you want then death teleport back to town.
>>
No. 948479 ID: 2adab5

>>948477
I had forgotten that part; thanks
>>
No. 948732 ID: 0fae41

Triple that hoard so we start seeing some results from cursing him with dragon's greed.
You wanted to send an expedition to an old abandoned dungeon nearby, right? Why don't you raise funds in town by accepting a quest to go beat up monsters there! Never do something for free you could get paid to do.
Can Alkaline reclaim the extra mass from her gluttonous goons that she didn't originally delegate to them? Portable Alkaline is good for travel, but now it's time for her to help carve out her kingdom.
>>
No. 950625 ID: 7ebbf9
File 157518318477.png - (26.98KB , 800x500 , pet_that_weird_dog.png )
950625

>Give him 193 and make a habit of rounding down to even 100s when you think about it to give to Chakarchelou
>Triple that hoard so we start seeing some results from cursing him with dragon's greed.
Yes, I want to see results. To let him kindle his tiny flame of draconic heritage much as I will be able to refresh my Heart with this new bounty of gold. Even though it's a not insignificant chunk of my hoard, I bequeath the 193G to him.

>Reabsorb your proxy golem into your main golem and see how the dungeon has fared in your wanderings.
I have no need to enlarge my golem body at the moment. That golem simulcrum I created is just a puppet. There's nothing to be absorbed.

>Are you going to keep those sticks stuck in your head ?
You don't like my headdress?

>That's what happens when you choose a plant themed dungeon. Permanent horns.
>We should have known Deem was getting horny.
>It explains a lot about her behaviour lately.
It's purely cosmetic!

>I think he’s always been like that, you’ve just never noticed until now.
>Or he’s only happy to see you because he smells all the gold you’re carrying and is wanting you to give him some.
There are many things I can give to Chakarchelou and he is quite happily staying after I tell him about the new gold he'll be receiving and scratch his chin.

>You wanted to send an expedition to an old abandoned dungeon nearby, right? Why don't you raise funds in town by accepting a quest to go beat up monsters there! Never do something for free you could get paid to do.
It was abandoned decades ago and seems to be fairly self contained. Still I might see if there's any interest in the town when I next visit there. It's only a week away.

>Deem is an old hand and knows everything about The Labyrinth Game... of a couple of millennia back. She really ought to send someone in to spy on The Guild...
I don't think they'd have much to teach me for such a risk. It would take years to reach any sort of senior rank and I'm not so awash in denizens that I can afford to send one off on such a task. I need to learn more about them eventually but building up my own dungeon is more important right now.
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No. 950626 ID: 7ebbf9
File 157518325989.png - (28.25KB , 800x550 , unpacking_time.png )
950626

>While a Delve surge can definitely move the Thaumatorium, I doubt one can simply move a void scar of darkness quite so easily
It's part of the room why wouldn't I be able to move it?

>I propose we leave it in its current geographic position, which places it very close to the center of this room; it will be "that room with the void scar."
I will consider it when it comes time to do that.

>That layout seems good for now, but I worry long-term that hauling things from the entrance to the living regions will be a chore.
That's why I have golems to do it and put an emphasis on improving the thoroughfare over time.

>Maybe this is standard practice for a larger dungeon, but it seems a bit odd the the former boss room and the hallway above it are entirely skippable under this design.
>...Also, it currently looks like the resurrection room will be accessible to adventurers. Is it meant to be like that?
Yes I will need to finalise how I'd use the west wing and no the Resurrection Matrix would not be accessible.

>Ooooh, this layout is deliciously elegant. The only urgent modification I'd make to this plan would be to reverse the pathing in the east wing by swapping the one-way door to the thaumatorium's southwest exit instead of the garden's northeast - the "front" and "back" of this room are a matter of perspective in my opinion.
Perhaps, I'll finalise it when it comes time to Delve.

>Can Alkaline reclaim the extra mass from her gluttonous goons that she didn't originally delegate to them? Portable Alkaline is good for travel, but now it's time for her to help carve out her kingdom.
Her delegation still needs some refinement.

>Hey, what do you think would happen if we gave Worst Slime some raw mana? Less risky, try giving it some of Alkaline's slime.
It would most likely explode into a mass of curses. This kills the slime.

We move our beat hunt supplies and spoils into my dungeon. There's less talk than I thought. Merud is at a sensitive stage in his golem project and it takes more time than I expected to get Alkaline's throng of slimes settled in as I have no lair ready to entice them into. We came in late in the afternoon. Soon Reisarf starts cooking and Hin is attempting to help or perhaps just steal some of the meal under preparation. Stargazer is mostly fending her off.

I am becoming less communicative; the gold is on my mind. It's stowed in my treasury, I can feel the earth-pulse slowly rising as the new treasure becomes a part of this place.
>>
No. 950627 ID: 7ebbf9
File 157518341338.png - (61.11KB , 750x600 , pearls_before_swine.png )
950627

My consciousness slows, dreamlike, as I let the thrum of the earth-pulse wash over me. I need to congeal and clarify my experiences into a new layer over the irreducible husk of my self.

My crystallised Heart creeps outward as I pore over what has happened since my reawakening. From the first of my new denizens, Chakarchelou now napping on his new bounty in the Forge to the newest slimes my little slime princess has budded. My time in town, exploring a little of this strange new world and recruiting famuli to my side. Getting to know them better, a not entirely pain free process: troubles with Hin, Moriko's troubled past, arguments with Merud and working on Reisarf and Stargazer's independence. We have had more than a few setbacks but slowly climbed onward. Invasions by adventurers, imps and one belligerent cauldron that I compelled to my side.

From memories and the templates of those around me I can open my Heart's scarred exterior and extend out new mana channels to recreate lost patterns. I am a shadow of what I should be, but this is one step closer.

I have chosen to be fecund this time, a dungeon rich in life. To nurture, mould and restructure the denizens within me and, yes, my invaders too. To prepare and equip them to find what they seek, then loose them into the world like arrows to seek their targets. They might someday shoot the Moon from the sky, should they desire it. To begin that work, I will set a mark on one of the chambers I have already created.

Brewery - Potent Residue: Potions can be reprocessed to give denizens a weaker but permanent version of a potion's effect by repeated exposure. A fairly weak but low effort way to tailor my monsters and denizens into different roles and to be more suitable for the dungeon I wish to present.
Forge - Curio Bud: Whenever a stronger magic item is created, a weaker item with some related attributes will be created. Somewhat unreliable as it's difficult to predict how useful the item generated will be but at worst it's a source of additional raw materials and study.
Golem Totem - Green Thumb: The dungeon's golems have an affinity for tending plants. Monsters have reduced aggression towards them. Simple but useful, especially if I intend to be sending golems outside once I have some options to extend their range.
Heart Chamber - Verdant Heart: Plants in the Heart Chamber have a chance to spontaneously transform into monsters. This essentially makes it easier to stock up on plant-based monsters for the dungeon and I may be fortunate if I try to plant rarer varieties there.
Thaumatorium - Spell Sprout: Plants raised in the Thaumatorium start to exhibit some magical traits based off the types of magic frequently used there. Essentially a shortcut to generate magical materials and potentially useful effects. However currently I only have have Merud and Reisarf as spellcasters plus potentially reinforcement magic from my golem body.
Treasury - Ornamentalist: The dungeon's denizens are adorned as treasures. They are easier for me to use magic on and have a higher likelihood to likely to develop equipment and treasure based skills. It also means a higher mana generation from invaders but I'm likely to lose some of the treasure they were carrying.
>>
No. 950628 ID: 679a6d

Ornamentalist's potential loss of treasure seems like too much of a downside, particularly this early in the dungeon's life span.

If we had Izakikk the Alchemist then Spell Sprout or Green Thumb would be phenomenal, though either could still be useful for the Cauldron.

Potent Residue could be useful, but I'm sure it'll be a popular choice thanks to getting certain, ah, "side effects" made more permanent.

Curio Bud would be great for generating useful equipment, both for our dungeoneers and as loot for delvers.

Verdant Heart is would be amazing to add a bit more variety to the monster selection, though how capable they'd be might limit the usefulness.

Among the choices, I'd say either Curio Bud, Verdant Heart, or Potent Residue.
>>
No. 950629 ID: 77e37e

Potent Residue, of course.
>>
No. 950631 ID: 977456

Curio Bud Hin needs some love, random items sound like a fun surprise, and it could get really potent once you upgrade the forge a bit. But mostly this is a fun option.
Verdant Heart is my second preference for similar reasons, and I feel as though plant monsters are quite a distinct challenge, freed from the torso-dynamic, so getting some weird ones could be exciting.

Residue would be similar, but I feel as though keeping track of all the variants would be annoying. The bud has the same issue with item flood, but is more concentrated and specific.
SS would be amazing for alchemy, which I would love to see Alkaline making use of...
Ornamentalist and thumbs sound shiny, but a bit situational or awkward.
>>
No. 950632 ID: 2aa5f0

Curio Bud or Verdant Heart.

Feel those would be the most helpful right now.
>>
No. 950633 ID: b1b4f3

>>950627
Verdant Heart. Because we don't have a monster tamer, and this is a good source of monsters. Plus we can try splicing plants together to aim for more advanced monsters!
>>
No. 950635 ID: e6f1ef

Verdant heart appeals to me both thematically and practically. Everything grows and blooms in your presence! Makes your heart chamber swagalicious! A renewable supply of semicustomizable minions!
>>
No. 950637 ID: 10c408

Hokay, so going in no particularly order:

Ornamentalist: We're not entirely bountiful with non-gold to part with, so this is just out. Adventurers are part sticky fingers by nature, so anything good enough that they'd want enough to keep is, at this point in time, a slight pain to reacquire if they still have it after being 'killed'

Greenthumb just doesn't sound as useful as the others. it'd tie up our workforce, we wouldn't have an excuse to rampantly abuse the plant tending for an almost endless variety of reasons (bomb plant tending could be a punishment, for instance) and any really aggressive monster close enough to our dungeon is going to get found out and either tamed/hunted. Undoubtedly it'd be kinda useful later but not right now.

Verdant heart is exclusive to plants and while we do have some, we haven't gotten Izakikk to sign on with us. (We should check up on this, see if the unfortunate amateur hour seance caused him to shun us forever.)

Potent residue would be amazing if we had more monsters to work with. Unfortunately we don't. And alkaline's specialization into group fighting slimes kind of prohibits the usage of potent residue as we'd have to seriously ramp up the brewery to compensate for the numbers of slimes we'd need potions for, so that's out.

Spell sprout is pretty damn good since we're undoubtly going to see more than a few mages among the adventuring parties that are going to try their luck. it would be my pick but.

Curio bud has my vote. It's literally free, though random, magical stuff that we can do almost anything with and the sooner it's effect is available, the bigger the pile of stuff we can work with will be. The possibilities are endless and I can't wait.
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No. 950642 ID: 9caba2

>>950627
My heart decrees that Potent Residue will be the most useful for us, not necessarily for combat, but more overall utility and flexibility. Also permanent passive buffs.

On a basic level, a low level permanent satiety potion could presumably lower someone's food intake greatly if they already don't see food as much more than a means of fulfilling their body's needs, and I think at least one of our denizens wouldn't mind a low-level version of the side effects either.

And who knows what sort of potions we might whip up in the future to use with this.
>>
No. 950644 ID: 56076d

>>950627
I'm rather in favor of the Green Thumb, myself.
>>
No. 950645 ID: 679a6d

Come to think of it if we did get Potent Residue a permanent satiation potion effect could get Kallia to sign on.
>>
No. 950650 ID: ce39da

At this early stage, we need “economy” and “strong theming.” Curio-Bud is ideal for the former, and Verdant Heart is vital for the other.

Both of these need to be obtained as soon as possible, but which to pick first, considering they’re currently tied (and with the brew no less)...

Solidifying our aesthetic is going to be important, but there are ways we can bridge that without plant monsters for now, and more important is having a more steady and expendable supply of stuff to actually give successful adventurers; my vote’s for Curio-Bud.
>>
No. 950654 ID: fb7954

Verdant heart! Plant orebushes, get robots!

Okay, I know it won't be that simple. But it sounds fun, and new minions for semi-free is fantastic!
>>
No. 950655 ID: 0fae41

Ornamentalist. I'm not sure what treasure based skills entails (abilities powered by spending gold? Multiplying the loot from fallen adventurers?) but being able to cast magic on them more easily should mean more impressive reinforcement spells. And speaking of more impressive, festooning your denizens in fancy new clothes will make them the talk of the tavern for adventurers with an eye for fashion! The equipment-based abilities as well could mean they adapt to the role they are equipped for better, still, at best it is an additional option to whatever interesting abilities they were already going to develop.
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No. 950661 ID: 3ce8ff

Brewery - Potent Residue
I like permanent bonuses and many small bonuses can add up to surprisingly fast
also i hope we can focus this new layer on fixing up our exposed mana channels so we have fewer problems using magic
>>
No. 950669 ID: 8d4593

Potent Residue, with Spell Sprout as a close second.
Potent Residue = Permanent Growth, and small changes means your more human denizens will be more willing to accept them. Mild utility aside, this creates small but tangible benefits that will remind your denizens of why they're here. The result is higher moral.

Spell sprout is my second because the Thaumatorium seems like the perfect spot for extended mage battles. Adventurers will burn all sorts of magic in there, while Reisarf and Stargazer's magic is top tier. Good incidental materials would be found after invasions and the typical materials found, though limited in variety would be quite useful.

Curio Bud is neat but I don't see the point.
A magic item is a tool that serves a specific purpose. Occasionally getting an extra-but-crappier version of whatever we make would probably just be something to sell. If we're making weapons then we could give the inferior copies to the slimes, but I don't think we craft enough (Or even have the material to craft enough) to justify this one.

If we normally upgrade the golem totem once can't we just double up the golems that go outside and make a gardner model? Green thumb seems like a waste.

Verdant Heart -> Plant monsters -> Both times we were invaded so far the adventurers used fire in some way
So nope to that one.

Ornamentalist sounds cool, but:
A: Can't you just have Hin forge some gold accessories for the denizens you want to more easily cast on?
and
B: Won't you be leaking less mana anyway now that you're congealing?
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No. 950711 ID: 2adab5

>Potent Residue
I'm guessing there are fairly strict limits to how many of these you can stack at once, since this was described as "fairly weak" per denizen rather than phenomenally powerful given time to build up". I'm also guessing that Potent Residue's mention of repeated exposure means that passive-granting doses potions would not be usable loot? If either of these guesses are wrong potent reside would pull ahead in the rankings.

>Curio-Bud
Not only is this neat, but IIRC dungeons need disposable loot for adventurers to potentially take, and our current options for this are just gold and some potions. Even if we are using the primary items for this, the resources from the secondary item would still be functionally a discount.

I vote Curio-Bud
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No. 950744 ID: e7c7d3

Let's go with Verdant Heart
>>
No. 950747 ID: e5e15e

Brewery - Potent Residue
>>
No. 950761 ID: 09e13b

Okay, some basic thoughts:

Potent Residue - We’ve know for a while that being able to mutate and customize our denizens, especially monsters, is something we’ll be able to do eventually. This seems like either a first step to that, or a way to get a weaker version of that ability before we ‘should’ be able to. Effectively we’d be doubling down on the ‘encourage growth’ part of Fecund. We also have Doyle, who makes the mass production of potions easier. Finally, this might be the best option for strengthening Worst Slime, if Merud’s golem suit fails.

Curio Bud - This option reminds me a little of the ‘Chaos’ dungeon option, actually: good for generating lots of cool shinies, but not so good for letting us use all of them in a cohesive manner. It doesn’t matter how many magic items we have, we still only have so many people who can actually use them. (Also, we’ve made all of one magic item so far, so it may not come into play that often.)

Green Thumb - The biggest benefit this has, protecting golems on missions away from the dungeon, is gated behind future upgrades. It would help us grow more crops and probably faster, but I’m not super sure if that’s really something we need? It’s not like we’re risking starving to death or anything.

Verdant Heart - Like Potent Residue, this feels like an early way of accessing an ability we’ve been told we’ll develop later: in this case, the ability to manipulate the earth pulse to spawn different types of monsters. It’d give us more diversity in terms of rank and file monsters, and we already have access to several types of magical plant (assuming fungus counts) not to mention however many species of regular plants can be harvested from the forest nearby. Adventurers WILL take advantage if we plant bomb seedlings in the heart chamber, though.

Spell Sprout - Very similar to Curio Bud, this makes interesting shiny stuff at random that we may or may not be able to use. Unless we want to start exploring far-tainted plants from Reisarf’s magic, I don’t think it’s worth it. Also, the Thaumatorium isn’t just a big empty room like the heart chamber is, it may be difficult to find places to plant stuff without getting in the way of fights or other use.

Ornamentalist - The benefits are tempting, but we JUST gave up a significant chunk of our new gold in order to empower Chakarchelou, having to do that for everyone in our dungeon sounds crippling. We would need a lot more gold to make this viable, I think.

Overall, Potent Residue and Verdant Heart seem like the best options. They’re both powerful, reliable abilities that will likely grow into more later as we reach the thresholds we need to get the proper more powerful versions. I’d be happy with either one, but I guess I’ll throw my vote behind Verdant Heart for now.
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No. 950773 ID: 768647

Brewery - Potent Residue
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No. 950775 ID: 7ad6c9

I would honestly prefer Spell Sprout. But out of the 3 options that are ahead, after reading what everyone's said, i guess id go with potent residue (although verdant heart is definitely the kind of ability i would prefer if i were playing a video game, i love that kind of varies-greatly-depending-on-what-you-have effect)
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No. 950781 ID: 944f3b

I'm leaning towards potent residue
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No. 950815 ID: 33056f

Potion permanency? Yes please. Potent Residue, for subtle shenanigans.
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No. 950820 ID: a7bb5f

Verdant heart all the way.
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No. 950851 ID: 996392

verdant heart>potent residue> curio bud
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No. 950860 ID: afa6f6

>>950627
Im going to pic Curio Bud, as the products can double as treasure for adventurers, or items we can sell to the shop in town for revenue. Plus, Hin still needs regular work to do and we just go a bunch of materials to work with.
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No. 950865 ID: f2320a

>>950627
Heart Chamber - Verdant Heart
I am still for chaos
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No. 951128 ID: 1ed92d

>>950627
I recommend the Brewery. There's some loss of potential compared to the Heart Chamber upgrade, but permanent potion effects is a steal when we even have Belphejar, who literally is made of potions, and have a great deal of experience in potion shenanigans.
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