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217269 No. 217269 ID: 42c416

"Once more unto the breach, dear friends, once more,
Or close the wall up with our English dead!
In peace there's nothing so becomes a man
As modest stillness and humility,
But when the blast of war blows in our ears,
Then imitate the action of the tiger:
Stiffen the sinews, summon up the blood,
Disguise fair nature with hard-favored rage;
Then lend the eye a terrible aspect:
Let it pry through the portage of the head
Like the brass cannon; let the brow o'erwhelm it
As fearfully as doth a gallèd rock
O'erhang and jutty his confounded base,
Swilled with the wild and wasteful ocean.
Now set the teeth and stretch the nostril wide,
Hold hard the breath and bend up every spirit
To his full height! On, on, you noble English,
Whose blood is fet from fathers of war-proof,
Fathers that like so many Alexanders
Have in these parts from morn till even fought
And sheathed their swords for lack of argument.
Dishonor not your mothers; now attest
That those whom you called fathers did beget you!
Be copy now to men of grosser blood
And teach them how to war! And you, good yeomen,
Whose limbs were made in England, show us here
The mettle of your pasture. Let us swear
That you are worth your breeding; which I doubt not,
For there is none of you so mean and base
That hath not noble lustre in your eyes.
I see you stand like greyhounds in the slips,
Straining upon the start. The game's afoot!
Follow your spirit; and upon this charge
Cry 'God for Harry! England and Saint George!" -- Henry V by William Shakespeare

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

It was on August the 3rd of 2023 that our world changed forever. The world back then teetered on the age of chaos in those days; violent forces abound as nature wept and men mimicry of moral decay or consumerism. Nothing but disdain lingered in air.

Then a solar flare shot out of the Sun, sending a shock wave to Earth that destroyed all the satellites that orbited her. The internet grew silent and all the function that surrounded this great web of computers went with it.

Chaos soon followed. Post industrial governments fell, retreating to their capital cities. The volatile indiscretions of human kind became the word for some years after.

But soon, the good people fought back. With bludgeons, blades and guns in hand, they took back their territories one-by-one. Out of the ashes of chaos grew new nations.

One hundred years have past since the solar flare changed every thing and a new group of like-minded civics have taken power in one of these nations in North America.

The question you folks must answer is.. Which one?

Would it be The Free States of Pacifica (Green), where Progressive/Liberal ideology reigns supreme?

Of course, they're currently at war over San Fransisco, Compton and the rest of former California with the Neo-Californian Empire (Brown), a united kleptocracy ran by collation of Bloods, Crips and Mexican gangs that put aside their petty differences years ago to create a functioning and feared government. And yes.. you folks could play a part in NCE.

You could be senators for the The Holy Mormon Democracy (light blue), a government of conservative, religious zealots that believe God punished the Earth via solar flare and that its their duty to make the land holy once more by spreading the word of God by any means neccessary. They're currently at war with...

...The Alliance of Canadian and American Republics (royal blue), a former coalition turned federation that's the closest to the original USA & Canada as one could get.

Below them is Grand American-Indian Republic (orange), ran totality by said American Indians, whom are in constant fear of an nation ran-stacking their small, land lock nation for oil and other resources.

Below them is Republic of Texas (Purple), where the political spectrum lays between moderate and ultra conservative as most liberals were driven up north. Even so, its still a republic and the folks are friendly enough, yet they're itching to expand and get more resources

There's also the New Confederate States of America, a false democracy led Southern aristocrats. Despite its namesake and some unfortunate racial problems toward the beginning, they're not a slave-owning state and treat blacks living their as equals, as they did before the solar flare. Interestingly enough, they are fighting...

...The Free State of Louisiana (yellow, because of its under attack), a nation predominately made of Blacks started in response to the violence that had transpired in the beginning. There's currently fighting the NCSA whom seek to gain their oil refiners, wells and oil reserves.

There's also the Community of Socialist States (pukey green), an empire led out of Havana that had the strange "blessing" of being a nation not strongly connected to the internet. Using their "superior" technology, they quickly conquered most of the Caribbean islands as well as southern Florida. They're currently facing a uprising in the Socialist State of Haiti (a non-playable nation).

There's also the Republic of Appalachia (charcoal). They would have probably integrated into the NCSA rather easily had it not been for a trifecta involving a sociologist, a charismatic evangelical preacher and a decadent of Byrd that successfully convinced said mountaineers that they were different from both Americans and other southerns. They seek to encompass the totality of Appalachia as established the Appalachian Regional Commission years ago and unite "All of God's Mountain Children". They're currently at war for Appalachian Ohio and Appalachian Virginia, using ACAR's and NCSA's other wars to their advantage.

Above them is the Democratic Republic of Acadia (maroon). They have many similarities to Pacifica, but they're currently rather passive in spite of having a sizable standing army.

Above them is le République du Québec (teal), the first nation establish on this continent predominately ran by those of French decent. Interestingly, it also includes Labrador, which is effectively their satellite state. They're currently following a policy of isolationism.

(That's all you can pick, but there's other nations as well.)

The Pink Region is terra nullus and is currently not maintained by any major government. In the north, its because of the harsh weather while in Mexico and Central America, it's because of violent clashes between various city-states that have been established by the drug cartels after the fall of civilization. The pink regions, for obvious reasons, are non-playable.

There is a successor to United Stated of America. They're in control of Maryland, Delaware and a small faction of northern Virginia. No one knows what goes on in there, as the out lying area's is protected by massive turrets that kill anything on sight, while DC herself is surrounded by a massive, 12 foot wall. No one knows their agenda, as no diplomats nor warriors have had contact with the outside world. They're a non-playable nation.

There's also successor to the United Mexican States (for those with derp, that's the name of Mexico), based out of Mexico City. They're struggling to take back their nation from the violent city states controlled by drug lords. Unfortunately, they're a non-playable nation.

Finally, there's Hawaii, floating out in the ocean all by its lonesome. They're a peaceful nation that has the blessing of controlling one of the world's largest navies. They unfortunately don't have enough resources to wage any kind of war and use their position to trade ship parts and local foodstuff for other resources. For obvious reasons, they're a non-playable nation.

Now, vote for your nation here: http://www.acepolls.com/polls/1145150-pick-a-nation-to-play

..and discuss why people should choose your nation in this thread. Voting will end at 6am Thursday.
27 posts omitted. Last 50 shown. Expand all images
>>
No. 218260 ID: 940409
File 128178391850.jpg - (5.55KB , 250x250 , Team Fortress 2 Spy Update The Ambassador Revolver.jpg )
218260

>>218254
"Excellent question, Mr. Black," he says to you with a smile. "Our intelligence division is average when compared to other nations within North America, but we're slowly building steam. We may even one day rival the New Confederate States of America or Grand American Indian Republic, but that will be some time down the road.

"Most of our spies are currently in the Holy Mormon Democracy, with the remainder trying to find out what the unusually silent north-eastern half of North America is up to. As stated before, penetrating the upper epsilons of the NCE government has proven to be difficult in the past. In light of this, the past administration pulled funding from that division to focus the previously mentioned."
>>
No. 218271 ID: 71a4fa

Is there a way to target NCE upper echelon gangs for bombardment? We don't need to resort to WWII let's hit it all tactics. That will just antagonize the civilians in that area. In fact, if we take out all of the ruling gang's strongholds, a rebellion might occur.

If worse comes to worst, we will have to get rid of the tyrannical gang sets. We might be able to work with the benevolent ones.

What is the possibility of building a puppet state out of NCE? I doubt there is much resource to be used there. Desert is a desert is a desert. We can just take the offshore oils by force with our navy then never give them back to the new NCE.
>>
No. 218278 ID: 632a2f
File 128179941690.gif - (366.33KB , 2298x2611 , mapLACountyLarge.gif )
218278

>>218271
"Please excuse me for a moment and I'll answer your question. I'd advise you folks to take a brief bathroom break, as this will take a moment."

The General would disappear for what felt like hours, but in actuality was only fifteen minutes. He'd return with a large, yellowed map, which he promptly unfolds and tacks onto the wall your chairs are facing. He then extends a metallic rod and starts to point certain areas of the map...

"We believe that this is the areas where the upper echelons of the gangs is currently call their homes; Malibu, Beverly Hills, Hollywood and Long Beach. By striking at these targets, we could seek to kill a lot of the gang leaders. King Rodgers also has many makeshift palaces spread through-out these four targets and if we kill him, we could create a power vaccum and have the gangs turn on each other.

"We would also deliver a blow to their troops moral if we struck here--the former city of Compton. It acts as a sort of quasi-spiritual homeland to both the Bloods and Crips. In spite of the fact the area was predominately Hispanic during before the flare. We'll kill a bit more civilians that way as well but with the possible impact to their psyche.. its tempting."

..and here's the map I used, in case ya'll want to point anything out. http://www.laalmanac.com/geography/ge30ba.htm
>>
No. 218290 ID: c00244

Not to change the subject, but what's the state of our international relations with Hawaii? As we're planning major naval operations here and they are apparently the major naval power in the Pacific, I'd like to make sure that's sorted. Heck, if they're a decent trade partner we might be able to ally with them, which could well be a decisive advantage in our current war.
>>
No. 218306 ID: 6a781c

>>218278

Absolutely not. I will not condone a course of action that willing puts an already struggling people under our guns. I accept that collateral damage is inevitable, but targeting a civilian residential zone for a moral hit is a terror tactic I am not comfortable with using. It will be a long and bloody fight before I become so unfettered.

Of course, that doesn't mean I'm not opposed to hitting known gang leadership homes. I'd love to see the face of any of them when they find their beloved 'pimpin' car with custom rims is a smoking husk. Assuming they aren't dead of course. I prefer the latter.

If it's moral we're hunting, then here's another tactic we can use. Propaganda dissemination, if you'll forgive my crudeness. Sit there, in the harbor, with loudspeakers set to max blasting towards the city every insult and poorly thought out decision they've made, while encouraging the population that Pacifica will not allow them to stay as perpetual slaves to the gangs. As far as I'm concerned, we want to hit as many people as we want with that.

A word of caution when we do launch the naval assault. Their navy might be utter crap, but their defenses on land when we approach the city might be tougher than that, do not charge in without a proper defense.

As for our intelligence operations, I'm fine with leaving them as they are.
>>
No. 218351 ID: 71a4fa

>>218306

Pretty much that. Also, can you hack their television? Sponsor shows of life in Pacifica. For instance, in soap opera... ect. The people of UCE will want to have a government similar to ours soon enough. But that is if we have a long time. Which we do not.

How do vassal states work in this gaming system? Do they pay tributes? Follow us in war? Can we have... uhn... advisors in their government?
>>
No. 218457 ID: c5628c

I would like to suggest that if ANY tactical action is taken against the NCE, that: 1) the Hover Dam should be disabled. 2) neutralize larger power plants and utilites. 3) and disrupt and limit roads and highways via surgical strikes.
>>
No. 218459 ID: 1c353d
File 128183812834.png - (2.34KB , 200x100 , 200px-Flag_of_Hawaii_svg.png )
218459

>>218290
"The Republic of Hawaii is currently our ally, but relations have been strained recently, due in part to Pacifica peacefully annexing the Union of Alaska and Yukon.

"Since we're more focused on keeping our own people feed, we couldn't afford to give Hawaii the foodstuff and the medical supplies they needed. They've since claimed that their people starved or fell ill, but we feel these claims have been greatly exaggerated."
>>
No. 218495 ID: 71a4fa

Shall we proceed to the next item? We can debate over this forever.
>>
No. 218502 ID: 1c353d
File 128184722551.jpg - (27.27KB , 446x301 , Maxheadroomhijack.jpg )
218502

>>218306
"I admire your conviction, Mr... Ovairsal, is it? Even so, I was just pointing out a possibility."

"As for setting the ships loudspeakers to max and blaring things out at them? It could work. It wouldn't work over artillery fire, so we'd act as a target to the gangs for any RPGs (improvised or otherwise) they may have lying about.

>>218351

"Broadcast signal intrusion would be a fine, viable option. Unfortunately, we're not sure their broadcast capacity or what they're utilizing it for. There's the potentiality, considering they -had- finest studios and recording equipment in North America, but they could not be utilizing it or just have programming aimed at the upper ranks.

"Either way, I'd recommend against it, considering the time it would take to give our ships the capacity to intrude broadcast signals. It would keep them in the harbor for longer than for what I assume you folks would want.

>>218495
"Of course, this fine young congressperson is right. I certainly can't spend the rest of my days debating all the nuances of this war, especially while this war is actually happening as we speak.

"The plan of action that we've discussed and the military has the capacity to enact is keeping a defensive position around San Fransisco, re-purposing some of the fuel rods in are nuclear arsenal to act as ship fuel, and sending some of our greener Special Ops members to protect Yukon and Alaska from raiders. The ship fuel has been re-purposed and put into our navy (it'll take about a season), we'll send our fleet to LA's coastline to bombard Malibu, Beverly Hills, Hollywood and Long Beach to divert attention away from our troops.

"Now, if there's any objections to this plan, you'll need to speak now. Otherwise, I'll begin preparations right away and hand the floor over to the Secretary of Domestic Affairs."
>>
No. 218515 ID: 644ca1

No I think that will be all for now, anyone else who have something to add?
>>
No. 218527 ID: c5628c

>>218515
Should we do a tactical strike on the Hoover Dam?
Or send a SpecOps squad?
(do we have SpecOps?)
>>
No. 218529 ID: 6a781c

As tempting as a target Hoover Dam might be, even if we tried, they likely have it very well protected, they know it is a vulnerability they cannot afford to have hit. Attempts to damage it would be a heavy drain of resources, resources better used at other efforts at this time. We will have to avoid that strong point, do not engage the enemy where they are strong.

Aside from our military plans, we have done what we can.
>>
No. 218548 ID: eededc

Hitting the Hoover dam is a bad idea, simply because it'd force a wave of refugees into our territory. If they start gaining ground then we'll consider it, but for now I think it's best left intact.

Time for domestic affairs.

Actually one more thing. What's our current state of relations with Arcadia? I realize we're separated from them by other nations, but it's always nice to have friends in the region, and we should keep some sort of communications lines available in case the Mormons become a major threat. And who knows, if the NCE attacks the Grand American Indian Republic, Arcadia may just be willing to form an alliance with us to deal with such unsavory characters so close to their borders. Actually, have the ice caps melted enough to allow us to use the northwest passage to reach them by sea? Because if they have, they could be a powerful trading partner.
>>
No. 218568 ID: 644ca1

I want to make it clear I put my vote for NOT touching the Hoover Dam. When we win this war, we will regret it if we have destroyed what would be a most valuable asset.
>>
No. 218569 ID: 538d37

No to attacking dam as it supplies power to civilians. As well, what is our relation to the Canadian and American Alliance? They are a large nation at war with the Holy Mormon nation, so it would be good to know where we stand on that front. they also are a power clot on the east coast, which we can benefit from if we are going for a diplomatic victory.
>>
No. 218822 ID: 587905

The Secretary of Defense readies himself to leave assembly to focus on other matters of importance.

>>218548
>>218569

...Until he's hit with another barrage of question. General Fitzgerald sighs to himself a little, lowering his face into his pal, then massaging either of his temples. It's clear by his mannerisms that he's getting slightly frustrated, but ultimately, he understands how new congresspeople can be.

He clears his throat and begins to to answer some questions.

Acadia and ACAR coming up.
>>
No. 218825 ID: 587905
File 128196382047.jpg - (21.02KB , 500x300 , dont-tread-on-me-gadsden-flag.jpg )
218825

>>218548
"The Democratic-Republic of Acadia has been a traditional ally for quite some time and unless there's a change in leadership and/or policy on either side, they'll continue to remain our ally.

"Of course, communications have been effectively disrupted between our two nations because the Mormons pledge to shoot down the few post-Flare aircraft we have in our possession, as well as any other aircraft that enter their airspace.

"...and before you ask, the amount we have is so small it would hardly effect our battle in the south but it would have a major effect on trade. We're already using hang-gliders and the occasional hot air balloon to survey the area.

"As for seeing if global warming had an effect on the northwest passage? I'm not sure. I'll commit a few our boys to investigate. This mission will take roughly two seasons, perhaps three if they encounter raiders or less if they find any stranded post-Flare ships.

"Conversely, we could also see if the Panama canal is still operational. God knows who is in control of it, but it's worth a shot.
>>
No. 218833 ID: 587905
File 12819656948.png - (6.45KB , 500x263 , BUNCHOFLAGGITS4.png )
218833

>>218569
"The Alliance of Canadian and American States has has been a traditional ally for ours for some time. Until recently, that is.

"Past policy-makers were also allied with the Republic of Appalachia, giving vocal support to the republic and on some occasions, armaments. This was meant as a way to counter-act the growing influence of the Confederates.

"Since those days though, Appalachia has attempted to annex Appalachian Ohio while ACAR was distracted in their two front war against the Mormons. This has made our relationship with ACAR strained for obvious reasons, even though we've officially denounced the actions of Appalachia and discontinued our occasional supply of armaments."

The general would realize he had somehow addressed congressman Gil's question about the NW passage while answering another congressperson's question.

"On that note, I'll hand the floor over to the Secretary of Domestic Affairs. I'll be sure to enact the policies discussed here. Until then, thank you for your time and I hope that I return with some good news..."

Upon those words, the General quickly left the room before more questions could be asked.
>>
No. 219212 ID: b06a3c

The assembly hall was a hush for a few, brief moments, to the point that one wasn't sure if another person was going to following in the wake of the Defense Secretary.

Soon, a female in her early 30s would enter the room, carrying an impossibly large pile of papers. Her heels struggle to get a foothold on the plush carpeting and all of her paperwork is sent tumbling forward.

"Don't get up!" she demands, "I can handle this." She quickly moves to gather all of the papers, putting them back into their respective folders before making her way to the front.

She lays her mess down on a near by table and looks out to the group from behind the large podium, which only succeeded in making her look smaller than she did when she was carrying the paperwork.

"Um... Hi!" she greeted. Her tone matched her mousy physique. She looked rather nervous and a bit unprofessional, which contrasted loudly against her meticulously kept, beautiful features.

"I'm Evelyn Rotterdam and I'm the new Secretary of Domestic Affairs."

You've heard of this name before and the rumors that swell around it. According to these rumors, she was once some mid-level bean-counter in her department until she caught the eye of the president. After a few "backroom deals", she quickly ascended the ranks and soon found herself in one of the most highest, non-elected positions in the land.

Of course, there was no conclusive proof of this infidelity, only hear-say from distraught, much older members of the Domestic Affairs department.

"I got a lot on my plate today soo.... let's get started!" She immediately started thumbing through her mess of folders to look for something.
>>
No. 219223 ID: cd1936

>>219212
Take your time ma'am, but I believe our primary concerns should be infrastructure and education.
>>
No. 219227 ID: b06a3c

After awhile of opening folders to look inside of one before closing it a setting it down in a separate grouping of files, she'd proclaim, "Ah-ha! You sneaky little..." before shutting her mouth before she had a chance to cuss in front of such an esteemed assembly. She moved out from behind the table to hand the papers to the nearest congressperson.

"Just keep one and pass the rest to your left and when it gets to the end of your row, pass it behind you." She'd then move back behind the podium and states, "What you see is a proposed system for data organization across all branches of government." She then began to point out each item:

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-+-Resources-+- ("These are graded on a scale from -5 to +5. -5 means that resource is virtually non-existence, 0 meaning that all needs were met with no leftovers, +5 meaning there's an over-abundance of that resource.")
- Consumables ("Basically food and water.")
- Energy ("This includes any bit of energy that could be used to keep the lights on, such as oil, hydroelectric dams, ethanol, coal, wind power, etc.")
- Raw Materials ("This is a massive grouping of all materials around the Free States that could be used to build all sorts of stuff")
- Recyclables ("This is a massive grouping of all materials and includes waste and pre-flare items")
- Infrastructure ("The vast network of roads, rails and utilities that keep this nation together.")
- Vapid, Brainless Whores ("..H--Hey! Damn it, Steve!")
- Refineries ("Includes all manner of factory or recycling center that can turn our resources into goods.")
- Education ("All the functioning schools, including higher education, around Pacifica.")
- Hospitals

-+-Government-+- ("This deals with the government's own... stuff. It's graded on the same scale as resources.")
- Budget ("The money currently in the government's coffers, generated mostly from taxes, but sometimes trade with other nations")
- General Upkeep ("This includes everyone's paychecks, repair coasts on keeping our buildings standing, etc.")
- Research & Development
- Investments ("Our investments in private enterprises we think are worthwhile.")
- Army
- Spec Ops
- Spies
- Navy
- Air Force
- Nuclear Weapons ("Mostly useless considering there's no sats to aim the missiles with, but they can be used to make conventional or dirty bombs, if need be.")
- Bio-Chemical Weapons
- Foreign Aid ("This includes all outgoing foreign
- Emergency Funds ("For when 'it' hits the fan.")

-+-Civilian Impressions-+- ("This is what our population thinks of various things. It's rated on a scale from A+ to F-. This will often include whatever's happening around the Pacifica.")

- The Government
- The Military
- Efforts to Curb Starvation
- The War with NCE

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

"Well, gang," she asks as she pushes her bangs out of her eyes and behind her ears, "What do you think?"
>>
No. 219231 ID: cd1936

Seems like a good system. Have you prepared an initial evaluation of our current situation using this method?
>>
No. 219235 ID: b06a3c

>>219231
She'd sigh a little bit, looking defeated, "Um.. No. There's been a lot of resistance to this idea in Domestic Affairs and other departments. I think they're jealous because I'm the youngest department head this nation's ever had. Because of that, they didn't give me the needed statistics to show our current situation."

She'd pause briefly before continuing, "If its made an official part of the government, though, I can easily get this have all the statistics ready by Summer, as well as the changes since this Spring."
>>
No. 219289 ID: c11403

Please have them. The congress can order for the data if needed. We simply cannot work without accurate statistics.

Oh yeah. No playing around with numbers either.
>>
No. 219290 ID: cd1936

I think it should be implemented. Also provide a speculative forecast for next season with that report if you believe you can. Assuming my fellow congressmen approve of course.
>>
No. 219291 ID: c11403

>>219290

That will be very helpful and I am in full support of this.

As well, if you can give us a prediction on how each of our decision will affect future statistics, it would be wonderful. We can even provide... additional funding if required.
>>
No. 219303 ID: c00244

>>219235
So you're essentially saying that you came in front of us with nothing more than a notecard that says "If I had information, I'd set it up like this!" Is this a bad joke? I don't care if we use your system or some other system, but expecting us to effectively govern this nation with no accurate reports in any format regarding its status is ridiculous. Others in Domestic Affairs can support your format, or use some alternative they prefer, but if there's not a halfway decent assessment of our national status in front of this body by next session more than one person will be taking a fall for it.

And if you don't start giving us at least a basic overview, fancy formatting and supporting references or not, I'll be making an effort to ensure that you are one of those people. I trust that as Secretary of Domestic Affairs, you have a good understanding of the most pressing issues even without extensive support from your department, or you would never have been appointed, yes? Let's hear them. The governance of our nation cannot afford to be put on hold because of bureaucratic inco- entanglements.
>>
No. 219308 ID: fd201e

>>219291
>>219290
>>219289

Ms. Rotterdam looks a bit surprised that her system has gone over so well.

"Cool! Alright. I'll get everything set up and in order and I'll even include predicted stats for later... Just be sure our department gets the funding for it, of course!"

"Is there anything else you guys and gals wanna add to the stats before I move on to my next item?"
>>
No. 219312 ID: fd201e

>>219303
Secretary Evelyn felt a little overwhelmed by that statement. She moved to sit in her chair with a heavy thud before saying, "You're right. Our nation can't afford all this er.. bullcrap that's been going on in our department. Even with my branch needlessly making things needlessly more bureaucratic than before, I do have the information needed to discuss any item you'd like." She'd move to pat on her fat stack of folders and papers.
>>
No. 219314 ID: fd201e

>>219308
>>219312
FFFFFUUUUUUUU--

But yes, that's really me. >>;

>>
No. 219319 ID: cd1936

I certainly hope so. Now... I believe our most pressing concerns should be infrastructure and education. They provide the foundation for all other improvements to be implemented. I hope you can provide the statistics for those. An overview on that first, we can dig into the details once we have a general idea of the situation. Assuming you were able to get that information in a timely fashion.
>>
No. 219322 ID: c00244

>>219312
Excellent. Let's start with the essential- food. How badly has the loss of our southern lands affected the food supply? Are we currently unable to support our population, and if we cannot, what options do we have for expanding other farming operations or producing enough of a surplus of other goods to import the difference?

>>219319
Education is important, but must take second place when people are dying of hunger. We can talk about it later. Infrastructure is critical, agreed, but it should be looked at through the lens of what we absolutely need to improve to accomplish specific objectives- like feeding our people or supporting the military enough to win this war- rather than generally.
>>
No. 219325 ID: cd1936

>>219322
My apologizes. I assumed our food supply was adequate since it was mentioned that the Republic of Hawaii was asking for food from us that we were covering the basics of our population. If this is not the case, I agree that education should take a back seat to improving farming and the food supply.
>>
No. 219331 ID: c00244

>>219325
Unfortunately, the days of exporting a food surplus seem to be past:

>>217865
>"That was, of course, until the Neo-Californians started muscling into our territory. As a result, the southern farm lands were either razed or annexed, which ultimately lead to starvation in some parts of Pacifica in latter season.

>>218459
>"Since we're more focused on keeping our own people feed, we couldn't afford to give Hawaii the foodstuff and the medical supplies they needed. They've since claimed that their people starved or fell ill, but we feel these claims have been greatly exaggerated."


Aside from the fact that we're being actively invaded, this is the greatest problem facing us of which I am currently aware.
>>
No. 219342 ID: 6a781c

How about the refugee situation? If we have trouble feeding those already here, the increased stress might be of great concern. Though, this is not without opportunity. These refugees might have skillsets and other things they can contribute.
>>
No. 219364 ID: c11403

What is the level of technology employed in farming? What kind of animal husbandary level are we at? Are we sending out fishing fleets? The pacific has been the source of tuna and salmon since days of old, before the solar flare, even before European civilization arrived on this coast.

Are we diversifying? What about mushroom, plants, foraging, and other food options? I hope the abundant forest of former British Columbia would provide nuts of all kinds. They also grow hemp too...

Privately, to other congress members and out of the press' earshot:

If worst comes to worst... we can always trade some hemp byproduct weed unofficially for food with underground organizations in other nations. Of course, completely under the table and done by private companies who conviniently sell them to the government.
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No. 219404 ID: 732129

Large scale farming is only possible thanks to the irrigation projects completed when there was still a USA. What water sources in the northern California region do we have a tight hold on, which does NCE have, and which are contested? Would a strike on the Owens River valley, or the L.A. aqueducts be feasible?

If you pinch off the water, the L.A. area goes back to being a desert; thus NCE will be forced to either move or rebuild the infrastructure.
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No. 219412 ID: 2ee18f
File 128213733155.gif - (55.70KB , 678x750 , california-rivers-map.gif )
219412

>>219342
"Interestingly, because of the effects of our war with the NCE, refugees aren't nearly as big of a problem as they used to be. Mostly due in part to a NCE policy that demands their troops shoot 'escapees' on sight.

"Even before the war, Mormons rarely migrated westward toward our nation and interestingly, focused on migrating eastward. No one has yet to explain this phenomenon, though we postulate it might be propaganda-based."

>>219364
"While there is some farms that use factory-made equipment, most farms are maintained through tool-aided manual labor. We've managed to keep most of the irrigation systems from pre-flare times alive and well despite the anarchy that ensued during The Age of Chaos. There's also some Urban agriculture, in all of our cities, with a lot of the land that was once reserved for city parks becoming said farmland. In theory, we could allot even more space for urban farmlands, but its effectiveness remains unclear and would require investment on our government's behalf.

"There's also some idle rumors that Berkley may have found an effective way to turn abandoned skyscrapers into massive, hydroponic farms. Such a system would require a sizable investment and years of research--not exactly a viable, immediate solution, but one to consider none-the-less.

"Our level of animal husbandry could be described as 'free range'. The factory farms of yore are almost non-existence, as the grain required to run them would cut into the farmland we're using to actually feed people.

"As for fishing, we do have some ships out in the Pacific, but much more would be needed suffice demand. With an investment, mores trees could be chopped down and refined to make wooden ships while the hemp from our fields could be used to make the netting. While this solution is a lot quicker than hydroponics, it will take over a year before it would significantly effect food production."

Evelyn would look to the congressman with a curious look in her eye as he suggested illegally trading hemp for food. "Wouldn't it be more advisable just to, ya know, have hemp farmers reduce their stock and grow food? After all, the logistics of this is a bit.. mind-boggling, considering we're surrounded by enemies and there's no air nor known naval route we could use to transport them.

>>219404
Ms. Rotterdam would pause for quite a while, finding an old map and the relevant statistical information in her mess of paper work. She'd then take up the map on the wall behind her.

"Alright, from what I understand, this [spolier]the gray-ish area[/spoiler] is the contested region. Above that is what we control and below that is what they control. Of course, that hasn't stopped troops from going even further north just to burn down a farm or two.

"As for striking that river valley or aqueduct? Probably. Tactics aren't my thing. I won't recommend it, though. The fastest way to lose support of the local people is to destroy their food supply. Just look at us as an example. The few people that were calling for a quick, diplomatic solution at the start of the war is now calling for their heads."
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No. 219417 ID: c11403

Perhaps we should consolidate our food producing area further up north. Despite the lack of sunshine, the British-Columbia-Washington area provides adequate water from streams, lake, and great rivers. The most important thing, though, is that this area is quiet well protected. On the border with the Mormon Empire, we have the Rocky mountains. There are at best four highway through the Rockies, including the Canadian Pacific Railway. This would make great chokepoints so only a few platoons with long range artillary on mountain peaks could hold off an invading army for days. I recommend looking at records of Switzerland during the old world war II and their plans to stall a German invasion. As well, once the enemy gets past the Rockies, there is great stretches of forest and lake that will restrict their movements. Due to this, I believe this area is ideal for our most important need -- that of food.

I would vote for cutting trees for boats to fish. However, I would also argue for responsible logging and consulting ecological preservation experts. I know in the preflare days, the University of Northern British Columbia and UBC all produced those experts in great numbers. Old cut and replant policies can also be implemented, although we will replant after the war is over.
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No. 219424 ID: cd1936

IS there any possibility of expanding the existing irrigation system? Or perhaps creating a rail system dedicated to transportation of farm goods and equipment? Both would greatly increase our productivity and encourage the creation of new farmland in the areas where the expansions were made.
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No. 220099 ID: 1e291b

>>219417
"We could consolidate are farms further up north. Our crop yield might be lower because of the cloud coverage, but its a start. Of course, a lot of the free, non forested land to in the Washington-B.C. area was converted for animal husbandry, as it was determined early on in Pacifica that North California and parts of Oregon was more suitable for crop farming. I'm crossed on whether or not to use said northern farmland for crops at the expense of the animal farms. Perhaps the assembly should take a vote on it? Just keep in mind that there will still be some kind of investment and northern meat farmers may expect some compensation.

"While UNBC and UBC aren't cranking out as many deforestation experts as they used to, there's still is some interested in a the field as well as some overlap from other fields. We could get a few experts to see to it that the forests are replanted once the war is over."

>>219424
"As for using a dedicated rail system for the transportation of food? Maybe so. We've managed to get a few of the rails linking the metropolitan areas of the Free States up and running and it carries all manner of foodstuff, people, raw materials and manufactured goods. We could change the ratio to allow more foodstuff to be moved through the rails and it could foresee it having a positive impact in our efforts to curb starvation. This still wouldn't solve the problem of keeping Alaskans and Yukoners fed, as the rails and roads leading further north have fallen into disuse and it would take some time to repair.

"Expanding our irrigation systems would take a lot of effort and investment. We could use the farm laborers and others displaced by the war to focus on expanding it, but it would take some time for it to have an impact. Perhaps years, depending on the determination of the populous and our government."
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No. 220209 ID: 6a781c

I'd first find out how much of our funds we can allocate to any project before we start investing in anything, not to mention how much. Concerning the farming and cattle industry, we don't have many options with the NCE at our doorstep. When we do manage to drive them out when our armies mobilize, I doubt there's going to be much left, and we have to worry about scorched earth tactics when we do beat them to a pulp. Considering cattle consume roughly ten times their meat content in grains, we're going to have to shift a to a somewhat more plant based diet. I'd rather have a bit of meat every now and then rather than having a pound of meat for a day and starving for the rest of the time. Luxury is going to have to take a backseat in this war.
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No. 220216 ID: c6b41e

Hmm... would it be possible to have troops that are being trained or on base duty to help with digging the irrigation expansions? Call it... practicing entrenchment or an endurance regimen if you must. I know that all troops are needed for the front, but if a draft is necessitated by the current conflict, this would provide a way to help whip people into physical shape for the military AND help the civilian population. Even if we don't reinstate the draft, this will provide another way to utilize troops who have to remain away from the front for security or other reasons.
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No. 220254 ID: 3e7011
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220254

I'm trying to avoid "serious numbers" in regards to the budget, troop levels or.. anything really. Mostly because math is my worst subject, though I'd like to think giving exact numbers would make this droll.

Let's just say the budget is currently at -1 on the stat system and that anything involving the budget can cost anywhere between -.1 clear up to -1.9. It's also perfectly fine go into the red a little, though once you start hitting -3.5 or so, the effects on the economy get more serious.



>>220209
"If this assembly wishes, I'll send out the call to start converting our northern lands as soon as possible. The question is.. How much of the land do you need converted from cattle/meat farms to plant farms? Until that question is answered, I can't guesstimate how much will need from the budget to make it work."

>>220216
Evelyn looked a bit surprised at such an intuitive idea. She pushes her hair out of her eyes and states, "Well, the impact would be small, but every little bit counts.

"Of course, it all depends really on where our troops are digging at. If they're doing it up north where we're suggesting we should put more 'plant farms', they'll be too far from the front to make an immediate difference. If they're in NorCal, they run the risk of being overtaken by the NCE.

"Maybe they should focus on expanding irrigation systems in Oregon? Close enough to the fight to make a difference if things got heated yet far enough way to keep them out of immediate harms way?"
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No. 220263 ID: 6a781c

A minor to moderate change might be needed, roughly 10 to 25% conversion. If this war drags out, we'll have enough to at least sustain ourselves, if not an entirely healthy amount. As for the budget, we're at war and going over-budget is practically unavoidable, but yeah, let's avoid putting ourselves in any deeper debt that we need to.
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No. 220477 ID: 7fd91b

>>220263
"10% to 25%?" she rhetorically asked before doing calculations in her head quietly, looking up at the ceiling as she ran the numbers. "I'd say that would cost us [-.1 or -.2], putting us down to [-1.1 or -1.2].

"I'd recommend starting off at around 15% [-.1], then slowly expanding it up to 20% if we that doesn't fully curb starvation."
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No. 220915 ID: 6a781c

It's nice to have back-up plans. I'd add more to do, but without more accurate information, there's not much to say.
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No. 220921 ID: c6b41e

Agreed. So the conversion of land and use of troops in Oregon to aid expansion of the irrigation system we can all agree on?
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No. 220922 ID: c6b41e

Oh and the adjusting of the ratio of food transported on the trains being increased.
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