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File 140351228403.png - (447.20KB , 700x600 , title.png )
82733 No. 82733 ID: c3ad33

i figured we'd need this eventually and since it's a collaboration i didn't want to lump it in with my normal disthread!

this thread is also the best way to talk directly to cryptidriot, the writer of a doll's circus and the creator of the characters and concept (i just draw the pretty pictures!)
Expand all images
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No. 82734 ID: a4f8eb

people started to point out some of the repliers transphobia and then an admin came in and started to be even more transphobic

>nice
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No. 82735 ID: 2fd516

>>82734
Please explain how it's transphobic.
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No. 82736 ID: 189a54

>>82734
I really don't think that they are actually transphobic. Their points on why being non-binary could be the reason for the protagonist being used as a Freak might not be what most people would agree with, but they were valid. Circuses have used non-binary people as Freaks before, there's no reason why this one wouldn't (especially since FRACTAL loves wrecking my feels with her quests xD). Just because they pointed that out doesn't mean they have to agree with it.
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No. 82740 ID: de9231

>>82734
Calling post 580275 transphobia seems to be reading the post backwards, seeing nonbinary->freak when it was actually freak->rare->nonbinary. I can see the argument against the post but it's not worth labeling the person behind it transphobic over one sentence and making followup taunts. (followup taunt has been deleted)

Is transphobia really the best word for that?

But more importantly if you're calling the mod post transphobic you need to read more carefully; it's not.
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No. 82748 ID: 0b90a3

>>82734
Congratulations, one of the most adamant opponents of transphobia on the site states a historical fact about the exploitive nature of the carnival industry and you jump down their throat for a perceived slight. I don't know how you got " even more transphobic" out of that post, but it sounded pretty respectful to me.

I agree that being non binary doesn't mean someone is a freak, but I also think having a transgendered protagonist that is part of a carnival side show would make for a very compelling story: provided its told respectfully and addresses the very real exploitive and dehumanizing nature of the industry in respect to non binary individuals.

It may seem like you're getting shouted down, but keep in mind most people are agreeing that trans =\= freak, and the mods here take things like transphobia, racism and sexism very seriously. If you feel like someone is being deliberately offensive you should contact a mod either here or on the IRc channel and it will be addressed.

Personally I'm stoked to see what our new spider-person protagonist has to deal with. Knowing fractal, it should be wonderful and heartbreaking
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No. 82751 ID: 6e85c8

>>82734

If you use the word 'transphobic' again I'm going to ban you for a day. Quit being an asshole.
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No. 82753 ID: a36601

Why does this argument have to be a thing? It's a background for a fictional character. One that we chose as a group. If you don't like the group's choice, don't read it. I just want to see where the story goes.

Sorry to the creators about the arguments.(and me possibly adding to it) I hope this doesn't discourage you from the quest. It looks pretty cool so far.
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No. 82758 ID: c3ad33

hey guys! okay, as all of u are aware, some shit went down in the thread last night and cryptidriot n i want to address it.

some hard facts: cryptid and i were bothered by the comment insinuating that the character's gender would be "explained" by them being a freak. we did not and do not agree w the implications of that, and felt it was a harmful sentiment. comments such as these will not be tolerated under any circumstance, and measures will be taken to prevent antagonistic comments that do not relate to the story's progression.

with that being said, we were also frustrated and stressed by the way it turned into an argument in thread. we have absolutely no problem with readers mentioning it if they are bothered by an offensive statement another reader makes - but if it's going to turn into a back-and-forth argument it needs to be moved to this thread. this is not because we want to censor or tone-police people - it's because we want to keep the quest thread about the story, not about meta discussions arising between individual readers.

we also want to make it very clear that the character's gender and the character's position as freak are completely exclusive of each other. MC is not a freak bc they're nonbinary. MC is a freak because they are half-a-fucking-spider.

cryptidriot and i are really, really committed to handling the MC's gender in a responsible and sensitive way - cryptid herself is bigender and i have (and continue to) put a lot of effort into educating myself on issues about gender. we cannot control the way that readers react to the characters gender, but we also aren't interested in swooping in and getting into arguments about it in the main thread. we hope that from now on, issues between individual readers can be resolved either in this thread or by contacting a mod and letting them know about posts you feel are inflammatory or inappropriate, which can be done in the tgchan IRC channel (which you can access via the link in the sidebar on the homepage.) if you have a question or an issue with the story's characters, take it up with cryptidriot @lungbox.tumblr.com or in the discussion thread.

we apologize for any confusion or offense that occurred as a result of last night's events and hope that from now on we can move on in a more productive way that is comfortable and enjoyable for everyone involved. if you feel you have been invalidated, please let one of us know. both of us strive for storytelling that is powerful, personal, and respectful of its readers.

- FRACTAL & cryptidriot
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No. 82759 ID: 0b90a3

>>82756

I'm sorry you feel that way, but as a fan of Fractal's work I can tell she has an immense amount of respect for non-binary individuals. She also is incredibly skilled at telling stories about those individuals in situations that are uncomfortable, traumatic, and emotionally charged while remaining respectful of their identity. If you don't have faith in her ability to tell that kind of story, I don't think you are giving her the credit she deserves. You don't seem to care about how most people are calling the initial post inappropriate, including the mod you labelled as transphobic, and instead you are lashing out at a community that is trying to agree with you.
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No. 82760 ID: 2fd516

>>82758
>bigender
What? Is that like, hermaphrodite? Except here it's girl/neuter? Oh wait, is it because her spider half is neuter? Two genders expressed separately? In that case, wouldn't her nonbinary gender be in fact explained partially through her being half spider?

>>82756
Nobody was calling nonbinary people freaks.
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No. 82761 ID: d8a627

>>82758
Alright, I'll remove the comments and refrain from posting such negative statements. I hope you can forgive me, I truly didn't mean anything malicious by it.
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No. 82762 ID: c3ad33

>>82761
thanks, toxo. i appreciate it and so does cryptid. sorry that this blew up into a whole big thing but i'm glad we're on the same page
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No. 82763 ID: e607cd

>>82762
Point of order: Toxo and Toko are different people
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No. 82764 ID: 721f90

>>82760
Being bigender isn’t necessarily about your genitals, it’s about the way you mentally process your gender and identity — not the same as hermaphroditism in animals. Fractal said that the character’s gender is not related to their spider part.
>>
No. 82765 ID: c3ad33

>>82763
sorry about that!!!!!!!!!! typo/eyes glazing over mistake on my part
>>
No. 82766 ID: c3ad33

>>82764
also i think there's just been a general reading comp hiccup here: the spider isn't bigender, cryptidriot - the writer i'm collabing on this quest with - is bigender. it was just mentioned to reassure ppl wrt our handling of the character. the spider chara is just, idk, something. general nonbinary. but besides that yeah, what u said about the characters gender/spideryness is true
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No. 82767 ID: 6e85c8

>>82764

When you use gender and sex interchangeably discourse about either becomes impossible.
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No. 82770 ID: e607cd

>>82767
Oh baby I will gender you so good tonight.
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No. 82771 ID: 2fd516

>>82766
Oh. Well I still don't understand what bigender means.
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No. 82773 ID: d8a627

>>82771
I think it refers to being intersex, having both parts, but I'm not out to make assumptions (as easy as it is to).
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No. 82776 ID: 675d4e

gender =/= sex; nonbinary and specifically bigender have nothing to do with being intersex at all. gender is in yr brainspace
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No. 82777 ID: 2fd516

>>82774
So... you're not going to explain it?
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No. 82778 ID: 8d42e7

>>82777
mm. nah. lets steer this entire thread back to its assumed A DOLL'S CIRCUS discussion. thanks!
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No. 82780 ID: 2fd516

>>82778
That's really frustrating, you know. It's also harder to take you seriously when you use a label without explaining it.
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No. 82781 ID: b1946f

haha so how about that quest huh

is the mc human sized or spider sized or somewhere in between
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No. 82782 ID: c3ad33

>>82781
we love u, b1946f

her torso is humanish sized (a lil smaller than yr average tween) but she's much shorter overall than most ppl bc her spider body carries her lower to the ground.
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No. 82784 ID: 8d42e7

>>82781
somewhere in between. their torso is human sized, but they appear short because the rest of their body is much closer to the ground.
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No. 82785 ID: b1946f

do they have human/spider parents or will their background be explained in the story

(also what pronouns should we use? she/they or a mix?)
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No. 82786 ID: d8a627

>>82785
Gonna use "she" myself, if it's "either or." The closest we have to nongender is "it," which sounds offensive.
>>
No. 82787 ID: c3ad33

>>82785
she/her or they/them are both fine, whatever u want. and backstory will be explained in quest!
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No. 82790 ID: c2d0cd

Now, to the more pressing matters: Our protagonist gets enhanced strength and superhuman reflexes? Spider-sense? And most importantly, spinnerets on their butt?
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No. 82791 ID: 8d42e7

>>82790
DEFINITELY spinnerets. the rest is still being discovered ;)
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No. 82792 ID: e607cd

>>82786
Since by my count, the vote was a tie between female and neither, until we have some sort of continuum of gender pronouns with a three-quarters option, I think I am going to default to 'she' for preference. :I
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No. 82793 ID: 675d4e

their name isnt anya *___* thats just awful!
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No. 82794 ID: 675d4e

... but now that i see that they call her 'aranya' i think maybe that would be too much literary irony for me!
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No. 82795 ID: c3ad33

>>82794
yyyyeah, that's exactly why we didn't go with it despite what a strong majority pull there was.
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No. 82796 ID: 675d4e
File 140358034351.png - (115.70KB , 470x700 , remei.png )
82796

heres a thing
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No. 82797 ID: 8d42e7

>>82796
HEARTS IN ME GODDAMN EYES!! THANK U FOR THIS
>>
No. 82798 ID: d8a627

So, uh, Aranya has to do with a show, right? Are they saying that in reference to "Freak show"?
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No. 82799 ID: d8a627

>>82798
Nevermind, I was looking at the wrong definition of it. It's pronounced the same way as araña, which is Spanish for spider. Took a bit of digging to figure out, but it's actually quite a nice touch.
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No. 82836 ID: 253678

what was wrong with anya? i didnt vouch for any of them and remi is g but im just wondering
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No. 82837 ID: d8a627

>>82836
See spoilers of >>82799
I'm guessing Aranya was a decided upon nickname fairly quick, and they did not want the real name to be so close to the nickname.
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No. 82884 ID: a28869

I went with "Anya" because after some research I found out it means "graceful" and "inexhaustible". I never occurred to me how that name was really close to "Aranea" and could be used to mock the protagonist. How embarrassing..
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No. 82893 ID: 72473b

this isnt really relevant to the discussion at hand but id just like to drop in and say that i really love how this quest is progressing so far! thank u fractal and cryptidriot for the hard work
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No. 82900 ID: 8d42e7

>>82893
ty so much. this means a lot especially to me bc this is?? my frist quest and i'm still getting the hang of worldbuilding/quest narrative/etc.... i'm rlly so happy you like it
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No. 82906 ID: 2fd516

Since nobody else has done the legwork I'll come out and say that "aranya" is "spider" in Catalan, and that's confirmed to be the language it's from.
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No. 82913 ID: d8a627

>>82906
...I already did legwork figuring out what it meant, see >>82799. Granted it's different, but it's close enough that it just feels rude that somebody else would say "Oh since nobody even bothered to look into it" :(
>>
No. 82952 ID: 253678

aw wow fractal i think the art on this is some of the best youve ever done :) and i've never read one of cryptidriots quests but yer narrative soso amazing and like just the writing is excellent, you guys should colab in the future it works sowell together
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No. 82960 ID: f1bfb0

>>82952
thank you! it's been an interesting experience for me so far - it's kind of a mix between my current style and the elaborate, delicate anime i was TRYING to do in high school but didn't have the skill to do, so it's fun to revisit that with more skill and experience. the characters and overall style are supposed to be based on asian ball-jointed-dolls, so to try to capture that kind of otherworldly, delicate style when my normal style is so blobby and shape-oriented creates a fun challenge for me!
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No. 83088 ID: 6b7ea4
File 140401678989.png - (272.17KB , 700x600 , Psquarednsfw.png )
83088

someone asked how peter and peter handle sexual encounters. their response:

"you know, we’ve never run into any problems when it comes to romantic encounters. our tastes are nearly identical, and we are very, very good at sharing.”
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